Support! I had no idea that they lowered the DU passing rate to 5%, and now I'm glad I chose to buy hybrid heats rather than DU heats. I thought it was still 25% because of the description for the Lion Scrotum.

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Yeah DU breeding sucks ass

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I agree Fathom, i had NO idea it was 5% and wondered why my DU had NO du cubs her whole lifetime. Until i was reading a base suggestion and was linked to the news post that had it, 2 years ago.

Think of Lion meat vs GMO, big price differences because chances are lower. I find it unfair paying such a big price for such little pay off.


Thank you all for the support btw

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But, hybrids have 3-4 cubs and DUs have 6-8 which is why it balances out when you compare them to hybrids^

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TL;DR rant time sorry!


Fair point, my perspective however seems to be that its unfair with my reasoning below, Thank you for commenting on a different perspective though!


Hybrid Pros: Naturally pass, do not require any items to breed it. Easier to market. Easier to pass origin bases and markings making an even bigger price to market. Both male and female can have this mutation, can be sex changed. First gens having a slightly higher passing rate, higher passing rate of select origin base when bred respectively VS a normal lioness [and DU's!] and cost a liver to buy. [first gens being as high as 1400+GB]

Hybrid cons: At max, have 4 Cubs. Half of the possibility of a DU.


DU cons: Cant market as easy, cant naturally pass, heats cost higher for low pay off, do not have an origin base that they have a slight slight slight boost of passing like mandarin and kimanjano. Can cost as little as 60GB first gen or not, does not have a raised chance of passing with its early generation process. Requires female cubs, but with the least expensive heat option can have all males. Alot of risk, little reward.



Results from the hardship the DU holds, is more rare. Some may think this is better for the market but, truly-it only kills it. If something is not truly worth passing, nobody will want to buy it. [similar examples being hybrid bases on normal lions]

I dont mind low passing rates, only that i pay for an item of having 25% chance, but in reality over paying for a fraction of that chance.

When ive bred a pon, their heat at most, for the best price and best result possible, was 25GB+500sb for opal saltlick.

Guaranteed 3 cubs, two being pons themselves in a single litter.

When breeding a DU for the cheapest way possible, 50GB+500sb. Some of the litter being male, therefore not possible to pass.


Imo, theres alot of risk for DU breeding without items that the heat costs, almost beats the selling point of a DU. Which renders alot of them not useful for most breeders.

Hybrids can be a headache to deal with, but when ive bred them, were cheaper to pass, and i easily made currency back selling those that did so i could breed them even more.

Couldnt do that with a DU, even when passing.


Either way, i still appreciate those who have different views!

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Yeaaah I supported a suggestion to this back when DU's were first introduced. The consensus then was to have it at a 15% passrate if not the full 25. Needless to say I was surprised to come back and see this was still the case with DUs.

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Even bumping it up to 10% or 15% would be better then 5%. I can understand why they dropped it to 25% when you have a mutation that allows you to have upwards to 8 cubs.

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Yeah to make it fair, the percentage should be at 12.5% which is half of 25% as du’s have twice as many cubs. Hence, DU breeders shouldn’t have to suffer because the creators can’t do simple maths!

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I totally agree, but it would be such a disaster if it was changed now?! People who have already spent hundreds of gold beets breeding their du would be pretty disappointed. It doesn't really seem fair. But i also think they should write in the description of the lion scrotum that du reduces the percentage

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Nah I think they’d be relieved, having more chance of success. I also think it’s a ploy to make people buy more golden beetles tbh like why have it set at a fair 12.5 when they could make it even more harder thus more expensive?

It’s disgusting really. DUs are not an inheritable mutation like patches or hybrids so why is the passing rate so low?

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No support.

The pass rate is this low because at first, before the adjustment, people actually spam bred them with average of having a DU cub in nearly every. single. litter. Yohimbe Barks + Buffies + Lion Scrotum were too powerful of a combo for this exact mutation and it's why it got lowered.

And honestly? With the fact you can have:
a) two studs breed her at once
b) end up with up to 8 cubs

Having just 5% to pass DU with Lion Scrotum is pretty fair imo.

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TL;DR for those of you stuck on the 'passing rate' aspect, please re-read the suggestion fully.


Two studs isnt an advantage why? Because need double the amount of items. Which means at that point, you are officially spending more on a heat than the DU is worth.

I'm asking for an influx?? No-5% for REQUIRED item [That says its higher] is NOT fair. They didnt want spam bred but theres 3881 Hybrids and only a little over 800 DU's.

If spam breeding was a problem-every new mutation/base/marking, and the hybrids would meet the same fate.

Are you willing to pay the same price for a GMO cow, the same price for a lion meat? No.

5% Is fair. Needing to PAY FOR A 25% however is NOT.

A potato leopon, can be sold at 250 gb.

A DU, can be sold at 60GB.

Just like hybrid bases, its almost not worth the trouble breeding it.

8 cubs is not guaranteed. Nor do they have special bases. Nor markings. No boost for said markings or bases. Low Market.


Im not asking for more success. Im asking to not pay for 25% when its false advertising unless you look 2 years prior


Also @ Spicy Kale, People were devastated when they were nerfed. They spent hundreds on their DUs, only for them to be severely nerfed and were quite upset because they could NEVER make that gold back.

The need to spend less is always a relief.



So 8 cubs sound great, but not if 6 of em are male.


Hybrids pros outway the DU's yet only the DU's are severely punished for it, it should be rare. I agree, however having it so low and paying full price for an item that says 25% is not okay.

There is no good enough reason to spend more on a heat for yourself for a DU, than what its worth. You simply cannot make the money back. Especially since not everyone uses Buffies, and commonly get 2 cubs.


you are right however, DU's can indeed [though not as common as you think] have 8 cubs. They do indeed help with breeding projects.


So why such low value?


If they have SUCH an advantage against an example like a hybrid, they should be more valuable but they arent.

People spend so much on breeding them and get nothing back.

As said before, being so rare isnt good. It makes it more useless for those who NEED to profit on either their heats or sell point to make the gold back to continue to breed them.


DU's commonly just like any other lion have a minimum. Most lionesses roll 1 cub, and while 2 cubs are nice, is extremely common in DU's unless you are willing to spend gold on their heat more than they're worth.


Again, those of you who argue for the pass rate, please re-read my suggestion.

I am OKAY, with 5%. I am NOT okay, with the paying for a 25% rate with the same pay off as a hybrid who has it free.


Ive set many examples on people like me who cant afford yohimbes at 15GB a pop, and all that other jazz. So the 25% Influx problem isnt a good reason to not support, as my suggestion states below. I have also stated to raise the percentage somewhat, not back to 25%. However, paying for an item that doesnt actually do what it says to the fullest of its abilities, is misleading. Newer players are not going to look at news posts 2 years ago, and wonder why their 60GB heats arent having any pay off with a "25% chance price" of an item.


5% Naturally? Fair.

5% at a 25% price point and not even knowing about it? Not fair.


Hybrids can be a headache. But imagine if folks had to spend 60GB+ on a hybrids heat only to make that exact amount when selling it. [Im aware hybrid heats can be this expensive but you would never sell a young hybrid for the same price as its heat]

I never have, nor will i ever see a [young] Hybrid for 60GB unless its frozen.


Nerfing something so harshly on top of devaluing them so bad, for an influx on a NEW HYPED mutation without any speaking to the community, as well as making their heats more than they're worth is not a good enough reason to not let DU's pass naturally with the SAME 5%.


Every new base, marking, mutation is mass bred.

Hybrids have higher market and used to have heats priced over 500GB because of barks why? So they could pop out more hybrids. Almost as if mass breeding them. Except they have to spend LESS because it DOES pass naturally and you do NOT require female cubs to pass it on.


So why was nobody punished for that?


Using barks on DU's, is just as expensive, and not everyone will do that. That is why i set the 'best price, best result' example for both hybrids and DU's.


In conclusion


5% passing rate? Fair.

Paying for 25% passing rate? Not fair.


So how could this be more fair WITHOUT CREATING AN INFLUX? Let them naturally pass 5%.

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Just a reminder, you do not have to support my suggestion at all, and please tell me why you dont! Things like this deserve discussion.

However i only ask to read the entirety of my suggestion, as absent minded as it sounds.

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Agreed. I spent 70 GB on a DU when they first came out, only because I was expecting to get more. Sure, with them being more popular, the price would probably be 40 by the time I was ready to sell, but not a big deal.
Then the nerf hit. Almost everyone was devastated. And as soon as it did prices spiked. DUs were at 600 when they were nerfed. 2 years later they still arent passed 900.
I had 2 born, sold 1, and dont plan to buy anymore, especially not with how expensive they are with it being very unlikely to be able to sell them, cause its extremely unlikely to even pass now, and I don't buy breeding items outside of the event, since that's how I make most of my GB. I'd honestly rather just get one through breeding then wasting GB to hope it passes just to be disappointed.

Hybrids can go their entire lives without producing another hybrid even with having a guaranteed chance each breeding. DUs are actually useful to the average player, and for breeding projects... and they got nerfed to the point of being basically just another lion that's extremely expensive. Meanwhile primals and piebalds havent been touched, and DU's are even rarer then either hybrid.

They really should be either natural passable, or have it around 12.5-15. It was disappointing then and it still is. I wouldnt even waste a lion scrot and a buffy ball to breed them- I could just sell those and buy another DU.

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Thank you for agreeing! Im glad those who played at the time have put some of their thoughts onto this even if its not so much agreeing. It gives me a picture on why they're this way.

Recently i saw a DU go as little as 40GB! It almost made me sad :c

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