Posted by The Problem With The July Event

fakeroxylalonde (#229548)


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Posted on
2021-07-09 00:01:57
Over the past week, we've been all waiting, getting excited for the new overhaul for the July event, getting ready to see what will they do. Will they bring back old parts of the event? Make a new story? Add something new to the table? We just had and wait to see

Then they took a massive shit onto us.


In all seriousness, this event overhaul has been a disaster fest, and I want to come here and share why that is, but first, lets go back to before all of this

Retired July Event

While, I wasn't actually here when the old July event has happened, I have taken looks in on how it worked before, and reading other peoples experiences about it while looking through threads and the wiki
For the most part, everyone seemed to really enjoy the event
Of course there was the issue of the really.. gross storyline that was present the past few years, plus the usual complaints about the apps being WAYY too expensive, but everyone agreed that everything else was fine
MS rate was more than great, with quests giving you decent amount of shards, explore encounters helping you out and being pretty generous with the MS rate + how much you get by fights, fireflies weren't an issue either because they were generally really easy to gather, and you didn't have to grind all too much to get enough to buy what you want, it was pretty balanced for everyone

but then.. this year came. and left to take a shit.

The NEW July Event

While, it is true that this event is VERY new, hell it hasn't even been 24 hours since it first came out, it still needs to by criticized for what it does wrong, and boy. Does it do many things wrong

I want to take the time talk about all the MAJOR complaints separately, since there is a lot to cover

The week before hand

While waiting for the event, MS were very hard to come by. They weren't terrible per say, just that the rate you were getting them at the time was very low, since it all come down to RNG and if the game wasn't going to fuck you in the ass with only 2-3 MS encounters every full bar of energy

Not only was it all luck how many times you'd get the encounter, but also how many shards you got was up in the air. The highest was only 5 shards, while sometimes you might not even get any to begin with

It was very brutal, especially since people like me, who had no shards beforehand, had to grind if they even wanted a chance at any of the apps that were in the temple

Now.. leading into that..

The Temple

While, I do think the temple was well made, where a lot of the old storyline decors and backgrounds were added, for sb too which was pretty cheap, it was still WAYYY better and cheaper to buy them of by branches, since they'd always be much cheaper. Not to mention the horrors of the prices made for the apps in the temple. Prior to the update, ALL apps were 3000 MS, even the free storyline one. They did end up lowering the prices.. for only 2 of them.

I get that these apps are expensive and shouldn't be easy to get, I feel like it's a very bad move on their part to make the apps that are worth MUCH less than the other 2 the only ones to get this sort of treatment, you were better off just saving for the 3000 MS ones and just buying the other 2 off branches

As of now, the apps have been removed temporarily, and will most likely cost AC, while everything else in the temple costs SB

While the temple being priced in SB isn't too bad, since they aren't as expensive, the fact that you can't even buy anything with shards is really.. weird.

You're being forced into playing the event the way they want you too, since the only thing to actually spend your shards on as of now, is the main gimmick of this event.

Celestial Explore

This whole event is entirely focused on this one thing, and if I'm being honest, I really like the idea of this whole thing

I really do think it's an great idea as a redo of the July event! But there is still many flaws to it

The main problem connects with exploring itself. While exploring in this new area, you will find alien like creatures that you have to fight in order to get AC, now.. this wouldn't be too much of a problem if the fighting system wasn't so unfair..

I had this same issue with the last event, where you can obviously see that the difficulty of these fights are artificially made, with the snakes in the June event, the rng for everything was just out the roots, hell many times I would have fights where we BOTH miss our attacks 3 times in a row. The rng was dogshit, and the same can be sorta said with this event. It doesn't help that our damage is so minimal and sometimes the enemy can do over 20 damage in just one turn, it's so unfair!!

This is especially true with newcomers who don't have high stats, so they just get mopped to the floor by these enemies and get nothing out of their shards

And even if you do manage to defeat them, you only get 1 AC each fight, and each boss only gives you 3 AC, unless you stock up on A LOT of MS and grind hard for it, you won't be getting much AC

Other Things

While these things are important, they don't need as big as an explanation as others

- Other encounters in Celestial Explore
I think that the encounters where you choose between 2 options is good, since you still get 1 AC without the fight + one of those new crafting materials, but the MS encounter is basically useless, since you're more likely getting less than what you spent on that step

- MS For Exploring
On that note, I think charging 5 MS for one step is a bit over too much, as small as it is. You're not getting much MS unless you're online all the time grinding, and even then the pay off is not the best

- MS Rate
Even after the made the encounter for MS much more likely to happen, you're still getting barely anything even with a full bar, at best you can get 30-40 MS each time, and that usually never happens,

- Celestial Raffles
While this is mainly unchanged from last year, it really bothers me and others that you need 5 AC just to enter. People are having it hard to get these, many don't have the time to grind and want to save for the Demiurge Exchange, so having to worry about this too doesn't help

- Demiurge Shop
The prices aren't too bad, but a lot of the decors can be frustrating to get with all the battles, not to mention how much the backgrounds are. At BEST if you win every battle and only keep getting battles for AC, it'll cost around 500 shards. For one background, that's absurd.

- The Apps
Before they were removed, people said they went up to 15k sb, that is WAY. TOO. MUCH. You're making it so people have to grind EVEN MORE just to get what they want, this is what people usually anticipate in these events, and you make it pay to play. At least they did remove it

- Grind heavy. Money hungry.
This event has been really bad for those who play it casually, or don't have the money to spend on this game. It creating a crash in the market for gb prices and sb and everything surrounding this, it's just pure chaos

My Thoughts

I really don't like this update. I understand how much work it must've been getting all this together, but it makes it all the more sadder when you realize how bad it's been getting with this event

I at least appreciate them taking into consideration all the things everyone is saying

Some things I want to add into the pile is..

- Either lower the MS Price for exploring or remove the MS part entirely, maybe make it limited to a 20 steps or so every hour or so, since it is a tier, but idk

- Make AC easier to get in explore/increase the AC won in battles

- Lower the amount of AC needed for the raffle, or change it to MS

- Make the encounter for MS in Celestial Explore 5+

.. But this is just what I think, if you have anything else you want to add on, feel free to!!

PS: This isn't suppose to be an attack to any of the staff, just speaking out what I've seen others say + saying what I think, I hope you can make this event better in the next few weeks <3



This suggestion has 47 supports and 4 NO supports.



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 00:02:32 by fakeroxylalonde (#229548)

Slade (#36600)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2021-07-09 03:54:40
New things sometimes take time to balance. I do agree on some points though.

I would like to see MS encounters always give above 3MS in explore. Over the last 2 days I was only able to get a few MS as it seems to regularly give 1-2 with each encounter (Rarely 5 and almost never 7) and that was a rare chance of getting an encounter too, even after the boost from yesterday. And daylight seems to drop almost none.

As a casual player, it seems Im only able to log in during "daylight" so it feels double strike against finding MS in explore. Its great that in the celestial explore there are still chances to find MS and there it seems quite common, but regular explore needs a bigger boost. This morning, I used 2 explore bars and my hyper boost and only got a small handful. I wont be able to log in later today as Ill be working, so my chances of being able to gather MS are greatly hampered by the low MS drop rate.

It should be a "pay game currency to explore" in the celestial area. Like fireflies, they should require some challenge to get in. But as said above, charging 5MS to take a single step, then getting ROFLStomped by an NPC only feels frustrating and demoralizing. Its such a beautiful zone to have, but the issue with MS is effectively locking people out of enjoying the event and the zone.

I think it would balance better if MS encounters in regular explore rewarded 3-7 MS. Increase the MS encounter rate (Currently on both accounts Ive gotten only about 20MS each side from 2 explore bars and hyper boosts, MS was 1-2 each encounter)

Tone down the hit and crit rate of regular NPCs in the celestial explore, but keep the bosses tough as they were meant to be. I dont care if I cant beat a celestial boss, they are supposed to be hard, but the regular celestial NPCs should not be 3 shotting my king IMHO.

Otherwise the event is beautiful and enchanting. A little confusing what some of the new items are, but still exciting and WAY better than the old event.



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 04:00:15 by Slade (#36600)

fakeroxylalonde (#229548)


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Posted on
2021-07-09 06:56:18
Yeah! I agree with you in that, I really do feel like the MS is very unforgiving, especially if you don't have all day to be online you really won't get anywhere with the drop rate.

I really like the idea of the event, I just wished that it could've been done in a better way, but what's done is done, we just now wait to see what they'll do with it



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Slade (#36600)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:34:47
Here is a battle with a normal celestial NPC.

Return to Celestial Explore?
Exhausted and close to death, you use your last ounce of strength to flee the battle. You lose miserably, and lose -5 energy.
The Starburst Being hits you for 13 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 18 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 18 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 18 damage.

Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being hits you for 11 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 18 damage.
You pound the opponent for 10 damage.
The Starburst Being misses.
You pound the opponent for 14 damage.
The Starburst Being misses.
Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being hits you for 11 damage.
Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being misses.
You pound the opponent for 9 damage.
The Starburst Being misses.
You grab the opponent with your paws dealing 7 damage.
The Starburst Being stumbles in confusion.
You charge at the opponent for 22 damage and stun them.
You have entered a battle with a Starburst Being.

Here is a boss fight, which I actually won...and got 3 cores. Id rather pass on bosses if that is the reward given.

You lost -10 energy and gained +489 EXP, +1% impression progress , and got 3 Axion Cores!
Exhausted and close to death, the opponent uses their last ounce of strength to flee the battle, leaving you victorious!
You pound the opponent for 13 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 16 damage.
You pound the opponent for 6 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 13 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 15 damage.
You pound the opponent for 13 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 6 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 6 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 15 damage.
You pound the opponent for 8 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You bite the opponent for 16 damage and grab them.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You bite the opponent for 11 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos breaks the clinch and hits you for 17 damage.
Your attack misses.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 16 damage.
You grab the opponent with your paws dealing 4 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You charge at the opponent for 11 damage.
You have entered a battle with a Interstellar Drakontos.



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 17:40:09 by Slade (#36600)

Desolace, Colorbomb (#36375)

Phoenix
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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:46:08
The starburst Being is WAY over tuned. Same with the Gamma Ray Being.

Return to Celestial Explore?
Exhausted and close to death, you use your last ounce of strength to flee the battle. You lose miserably, and lose -5 energy.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 15 damage.
You pound the opponent for 13 damage.
The Starburst Being hits you for 12 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 17 damage.
Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being misses.
Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being stumbles in confusion.
You pound the opponent for 16 damage and stun them.
The Starburst Being hits you for 13 damage.
You are stunned and cannot move.
The Starburst Being pounds you in the head for 18 damage.
Your attack misses.
The Starburst Being misses.
You pound the opponent for 12 damage.
The Starburst Being hits you for 11 damage.
You grab the opponent with your paws dealing 4 damage.
The Starburst Being hits you for 17 damage.
You charge at the opponent for 11 damage.
You have entered a battle with a Starburst Being.

Here is a boss fight:

Return to Celestial Explore?
You lost -10 energy and gained +489 EXP, +1% impression progress , and got 3 Axion Cores!
Exhausted and close to death, the opponent uses their last ounce of strength to flee the battle, leaving you victorious!
You pound the opponent for 11 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 18 damage.
You pound the opponent for 10 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 19 damage.
You pound the opponent for 10 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 13 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 14 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos stumbles in confusion.
You pound the opponent for 16 damage and stun them.
The Interstellar Drakontos misses.
You pound the opponent for 11 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 18 damage.
You grab the opponent with your paws dealing 8 damage.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 13 damage.
You try to grab the opponent but fail.
The Interstellar Drakontos hits you for 19 damage.
You charge at the opponent for 9 damage.
You have entered a battle with a Interstellar Drakontos.



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 17:48:15 by Desolace, Incubus (#36375)

Magnituda [sunrise
project] (#198042)


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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:47:59
Okay to be fair now most of dragons/beings are easy to combat if you figure out the moves (like "Claw" for Wavyrns).



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Slade (#36600)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:53:54
Drakes arent bad at all. Some of the others though are super crazy and crit for over 20 hp 3-4 times in a row.



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Mwothman (#138189)

Spicy
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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:55:16
Magnituda, that isn't the point- the point is that the drop rate for MS is still too low, and that even if you do happen to win, there should be more of a payout for winning a battle. IDK, 1 AC is quiet frankly bullshit, but if it was 1 AC and maybe 2-4 MS then I wouldn't have a huge problem.



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Magnituda [sunrise
project] (#198042)


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Posted on
2021-07-09 17:58:48
Drop rate is now 5-10 so definitely better. For getting more MS I would support new encounter in normal explore for 30MS (instead of the one with Appollyon we've had) though



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 17:59:26 by Magnituda [G2 clouded Cinna] (#198042)

Mwothman (#138189)

Spicy
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Posted on
2021-07-09 18:04:04
There definitely needs to be more encounters! Maybe even the freaking Demiurge morphing down and being like "yo come help"



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Moony the 2nd-G2
Noctis Ferus (#108860)

Maneater
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Posted on
2021-07-09 18:05:01
Yeah, I agree that the AC raffle price should be lowered as it is too high for the small drop we get. The AC drop rate should be increased as well, cause the fights are way too damn hard. I don't grind for stats so it did bother me that I kept losing time and time again. Luckily, I hoarded way too many lucky feet, but still. I shouldn't have to rely on those just to get cores.
I also agree that rates for shards should be higher in the regular explore and that the cost for each step is about 1-2 shards. I think eventually, they'll make a shop for shards. They did that with the snake scales so I'm not too fussed about that.

The drop rate for everything is my biggest issue. Hope they continue to improve upon it



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Edited on 09/07/21 @ 19:17:56 by Moony the 2nd (Ebony Breeder) (#108860)

fakeroxylalonde (#229548)


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Posted on
2021-07-09 18:09:37
I think that new encounters can help, maybe you can get 10+ shards from meteor showers occurring around, while having smaller chances of getting 20 or 30, having some of the shop npcs help you by lending you some currency, asteroids falling down onto the surface and having some shards for you to pick up

And while I agree with maybe getting shards while doing fights, I think it's better to either make AC a 1-3 for normal fights, 3-6 for bosses or just permanently increasing them to a middle set number

One small thing also is that, even if you don't need energy to do the battles, if you have energy you still do lose it after the battle, it is small but it can be annoying sometimes



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Slade (#36600)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2021-07-11 03:14:22
Ok, so the last 2 days, as a casual that has to work, I observed that with the Hyper boost and 2 full energy bars, the average MS gain between 2 accounts is about 33 shards per account.

That means for every full energy bar, the average gain is about 15-20 MS. Thats 3-4 steps in the event explore, per day, for a casual player. (And take into account people breed lions, so a lot of energy is going into breeding)

After exploring in the event explore, losing a battle, which is quite common, we lose 5 energy. So if a person is able to save some energy for farming MS in regular explore, they lose energy in the event explore thus losing further opportunity in gaining MS in regular explore.

The battles in the event explore only offer AC, which can get decor or raffle lions. I dont use decor often and I have never once in all the years Ive played won a raffle lion from July, so Im not really compelled to try the raffle. And although the decor that can be bought with AC is pretty, I really dont feel a need or desire to have it, use it, sell it, or grind so much effort for it. As for MS used as currency for more decors, there just isnt much I would want until the apps are released again. So, for me, I really have no compulsion to play the event any further. Which is sad, because its quite beautiful.

Another thought, it takes winning 5 battles to get enough AC to put in for a raffle lioness. Which takes MS to be able to access the event explore. With 5MS per event explore step, it would take 25 MS at the bare minimum if you get a battle per every step and win every time. The sheer number of MS required to gain enough to explore for 5 battles and win 5 battles, just to roll the dice against 2000 players trying to win a special lioness is mind boggling.

On a personal note, this event has a certain "Wolvden Style" vibe to it. I dont play Wolvden because its not my style. I really hope Lioden isnt being geared more to the style of Wolvden. I dont play there because I dont care for its structure or its way of doing events. Its a gorgeous game, but not my style. I like Lioden's structure and it would be a shame to see it move to the Wolvden platform. This event is structured very similar to their lunar event and it concerns me greatly that they are implementing it here, even if it is just for the month of July.

Summery:

*The event is pretty, but the effort vs reward is not compelling.

*Fights are over tuned for the effort of gaining AC, which gets decor or a "chance" at a special lioness.

*MS to explore, 5 per step, to get ROFLstomped by NPCs for currency that gives decor isnt compelling enough to grind for it.

*Using MS as a currency for decor or for a chance to gain entrance in the event explore is too costly for how low the MS drop rate is.

*Although the event is beautiful, it feels as though the artists put a huge effort into it, only to have the event feel as though the difficulty so over done, that it effectively locks out a large group of people from actually enjoying it. Frustration turns off the desire to play the event and basically it loses all magic.

*Using event currency that costs dearly to gain as a lottery with a low chance of returns it demoralizing.

That being said, I think Ill be bowing out of this event. As pretty as it is, I cannot justify putting in so much effort for very little return. I may dabble in it for laughs, but I am no longer interested in expending the energy. Hats off to the artists who put so much work into it. Its beautiful.

Edit: After typing this, I had 80% energy and went exploring. I got 8MS shards. I then used the full free daily energy bar and got 7MS. Thats 15 MS per 1.8 energy bars.



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Edited on 11/07/21 @ 03:30:51 by Slade (#36600)

Leara_Lawson (#208626)

Impeccable
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Posted on
2021-07-21 00:51:35
honestly, my only real problem is the fact that you cant use MS to buy things in the temple. last year id saved ups over 600 ms so that this year, i could buy a lot of really cool stuff, but now, i cant, and so now i feel like i waisted hrs on gathering usless items. cause evn if u use them for the celestial explore, its not worth it very much, just cause of how hard it is to win a fight, and how rare the axion cores are compared to the amount of shards it costs to even explore.



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sage 🌿~ Side (#236077)

Usual
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Posted on
2021-07-21 04:21:17
My problem is how overpowered some of the encounters are.

There's no tactics that can help for that.


However, I am glad they changed the price of the apps; they're now decently obtainable.
I'm also happy about the higher drop rate of MS and how your guaranteed to get something in celestial explore.

Overall, I think the event does have loads of potential, but it still needs some tweaks.



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Edited on 21/07/21 @ 04:29:35 by axel 💫MR/G3/Sutekh (#236077)







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