Posted by OVERHAUL: Raffle/Special Lionesses

Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

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Posted on
2021-10-09 17:14:08
I searched all topics and only came up with one that was vaguely similar, so here we go!

This is a complete and total overhaul of the weekly Raffle/Special Lionesses! I'll not only be putting in my own ideas, but I'll link associated suggestions as well.

Please note that anything listed SUGGESTION is from other players and while to be taken into consideration, they are things I may not necessarily agree with 100%! However, they'll be added for the admins to think about regardless. ^^

An Overview


For a long time now, I've thought that RLs were... lacking. A good many of them look very similar to one another, and there's always been a touch of drama around them, especially when they introduce completely new bases, markings or marking slots. Sometimes, RLs go to inactive accounts - sometimes, they go to accounts that don't spread the markings/base/etc, for whatever reason they may have. Which is fine, to some extent! The RL is theirs to do with what they will.

I've also found some of the designs to be same-y and lackluster. Special lionesses are supposed to be unique, rare, and - as the name suggests - special! I understand that a lot of folks like natural markings and natural looks, and that's okay! But with the way things are, the number of RLs that look almost identical in golds and creams is outweighing those that look more unique.

So! I want to create an overhauled RL system that caters to everyone, and completely avoids the sour tastes that a lot of folks get. It will address not only the method of spreading marks, skins, eyes, bases, etc etc more freely, but also give some ideas on how to make more unique-looking RLs alongside natural ones, and keep the drama out for good!

Weekly Raffle Lionesses: Number of RLs


Inspired by this topic and this topic, I suggest we up the number of Raffle Lionesses from three to five a week in addition to further changes noted below. One a week serving a community of hundreds of thousands of members is growing too much to deal with; especially with brand-new colors in brand-new slots! It may take months or years for a marking to spread if something that doesn't have that mark never gets kinged.

I suggest one of these RLs stay natural; creams and golds, blended markings, low opacities. One should be bolder and brighter, with non-natural colors and markings. They should however SHARE the trait or traits we want to spread; the new-slot or new-color markings, bases, skin/eye color, etc. Everything else about them should be different. More on that below.

SUGGESTION BY WHALES0NG: And perhaps only one RL per week could be entered for per account, so that it evens things out a little? :o

SUGGESTION BY WHALES0NG: how about two per week, where players can choose which one to attempt to impress, or alternating between one and two each week?

Weekly Raffle Lionesses: Appearances


RLs are meant to be unique, unlike any other lion on the site; truly special! However, one thing I've noticed is that - in recent years, RLs have very very few (if any) markings that are not BO. Raffle and event marks are great, but there are only so many of them, and there's only so much you can do with them to make a design truly look interesting and unique, without copying what's come before.

I suggest opening up RLs to more types of markings, as well as eyes and skin! Perhaps set a limit on 5 BO markings, and have the rest be whatever suits the design most. More BO markings can be added, AS LONG AS they contribute to the design being unique, especially when we get more BO marking shapes! Focus more on the overall aesthetic of the lion, and less on how much value it may carry! Do not be afraid to use Tier 0/1, piety, or RMA marks if it adds to the appeal of the RL's appearance.

For having three or more RLs a week with at least one rare/semi-rare, or new marking/base/eye/skin color, these RLs should share at LEAST one rare trait among them. However, everything else should go into making the design unique and stand out among at least three different 'types' of RL:

- natural colors and blendy markings; reds, creams, golds, whites, low opacities.

- bolder colors and markings, higher opacities; non-natural traits

- any others - from #3 to #5 - should be wildcards! could be either or, or a median.

As long as there's one for both usual categories RLs commonly fall into, I'm sure all parts of the community will have something to enjoy.

Weekly Raffle Lionesses: Designers


Currently, I believe there is only one person doing RL designs. The designs are usually very good! But as I stated before, there's only so much one person can do. Should RLs be expanded to three, four, or five a week, I suggest one of the following methods be taken to cope with the increase in design, and add a little more variety between designs:

- bring in two or three alt designers a month from trusted individuals either from the userbase that mods can vouch for, or from mods themselves who are known to be good designers (please do not choose the ones that designed the maneaters this year I beg you)

- perhaps have a staff board who goes over submitted designs and suggest tweaks before release

SUGGESTION FROM AGGY:
- reopen player submissions BUT ONLY anonymous submissions through modbox

- if player designs are reopened, allow for tweaking to occur based on staff oversight to make sure a design not only fits the requirements, but can also be used in a way to refine them enough so that one single person cannot throw hands over a design they made that they didn't get

- IF player designs are reopened, be very heavy-handed in banning over RL harassment; a zero tolerance policy must be upheld

Weekly Raffle STUDS


Inspired by this topic, but a new take on the idea similar to Wolvden's raffle studs!

A single stud either once a week, or once a month, with a minimum of TWO rare/semi-rare BO marking, base, or trait and a maximum of THREE to promote spread.

These are fully designed, with other markings that are generally tier 0 or tier 1, but can also be rarely piety or other tier 3, maybe tier 6. Bases would likely be uncommon or rare unless one of the traits is a BO or event base! These studs can have anywhere from 3 extra (non-BO) to 9 extra (non-BO) markings on them, whatever fits the design. NO ROSETTES. However, this is NOT to be a way to introduce new markings, only spread failing BO markings or other rare traits!

Each member can breed one lioness to this stud, guaranteed on the first try. However, like event studs, they cannot have items used on them - and so actually passing whatever rare traits they have is completely up to RNG.

Another, very optional idea: raffle studs are open to all players regardless of impression! Prices are discussed below.

The rare traits on these studs can work in tandem with the RLs of the week, be based on weeks prior, or past RLs that have since had markings or other traits die with them. They could even be month-themed. Lots of fun to be had with those designs!

Here is an example of a fully designed raffle stud; two BO marks (though I didn't check slots just for this example), and the rest common/piety marks that fit the design!

SUGGESTION BY BILBY:
I'd honestly bump the range to 5-8 BO traits, if it's including the potential for base/traits; the bar for "I'd spend currency to breed to it" is 2-3 traits between eyes/skin/mane/colour/base (uncommon/rare/maybe an extremely struggling special like pearl?) and 3 bo marks?

^ For the admins' consideration, in case my suggestion isn't taken!

Raffle-Entry Pricing


This is a suggestion inspired by Dalton!

Instead of 50SB flat, one way to change up the way special lionesses are raffled off is to have each ask for a different price. One may ask for ten cubs under a year old; another may ask for 10 uses of a toy or food. Perhaps two or three cave building materials, or one of those super-common patrol or explore decors. 50SB could pop up time to time, as well! Nothing too extravagant, but make it a little more varied to dive into! All of the RLs should have differing things to ask,

These could have neat flavor texts as well - perhaps the one looking for cubs is a mother who lost hers, and the one who needs skulls collects them. Maybe the one needing cave materials is building a den for her sister! Lots of potential here.

Raffle Lioness/Lion Lore


Stemming off of the idea of flavor text, I LOVE the idea Wolvden had where the raffle stud wolves come from their own specific place. This is completely optional and only for story things, but there could be a bit of info about the pride they come from, where they live, the lives they left behind. Wouldn't need to create a whole fake pride account, but a few blurbs here and there one can cycle through saying a bit on what kind of life the RL had before.

Weekly Raffle Lioness Drawing


There are many, many RLs that end up going to accounts that log in, join the raffle, and never log in again. The number of special lionesses sitting on inactive accounts is enough to make a grown man cry! Therefore, I suggest the following restrictions to how RLs are drawn and given out to give much better chances on them landing on active accounts:

- if an RL is drawn, it must go to an account that has rolled the day before drawing, and that account must roll the day after the draw as well, so that there is much less of a chance for it to go to an inactive account

- if the account fails both of these, the RL either skips it or is redrawn

- I suggest ending the RL raffles on Thursday instead of Friday for this reason, so that it has a chance to find a proper account before it's announced on the news post

While this isn't foolproof - as there's no real way of ABSOLUTELY and completely avoiding RLs sitting on inactive accounts - it might up the chances of a special lioness with great traits going to folks who will help spread her markings/base/etc instead of allowing a particular new or rare trait to stagnate and die.

SUGGESTION BY TERRINTHIA: I feel like a day is too short tbh, as much as I hate seeing them go into inactive accounts. Probably a week of not rolling would be the lowest I could really agree with.

SUGGESTION BY WHALES0NG: A possible solution for the inactive accounts issue could be some sort of acceptance system, perhaps? Say a winner has 72 hours to roll and press a button to accept their RL before the drawing is re-rolled and passed to the next person drawn, like how it is done if a winner has no free territory to accept her. There would definitely have to be no way for the first winner to know that they’d originally drawn and missed their chance, though, again just like the full territory issue.

RELATED SUGGESTION: here!

The End!


That's all, folks! If you read through this whole rambling thing, you get a virtual medal! Please leave your thoughts and opinions below, and make sure to comment along with your vote!



This suggestion has 53 supports and 20 NO supports.



Edited on 14/10/21 @ 10:32:53 by Verridith [g1 striped stellar] (#407)

Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

Interstellar
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Posted on
2021-10-09 17:14:49

Misc Suggestions:



SUGGESTION BY ZENATII: I think rather than having RLs that get cloned to buggery, I’d love to see reverse heats done. I’m not sure how, but I think I’d like that more



Edited on 09/10/21 @ 18:20:18 by Verridith [g1 striped stellar] (#407)

Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

Interstellar
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Posted on
2021-10-09 17:14:55
And this one!


Terrinthia [G1
Sutekh Near RL] (#97101)

Cursed
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Posted on
2021-10-09 17:35:27
I feel like a day is too short tbh, as much as I hate seeing them go into inactive accounts. Probably a week of not rolling would be the lowest I could really agree with. I support, though!


Ocean Breeze (lights
off) (#208541)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2021-10-09 17:50:30
This is an amazing suggestion, immediate support


Zenatii {Lights On!} (#156684)

Maneater
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Posted on
2021-10-09 18:13:15
Agreeing with Terrinthia- even I drop off for a week at a time sometimes.

I think rather than having RLs that get cloned to buggery, I’d love to see reverse heats done. I’m not sure how, but I think I’d like that more



Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

Interstellar
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Posted on
2021-10-09 18:19:35
Added some suggestions! Thank y'all!! <3


Lionfish (#4551)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2021-10-09 19:12:57
I think some of the ideas in this thread sound nice, but I don't like the idea of having a hard limit of 5 bo markings per lioness.

One reason RL clones are so highly valued is because it's so difficult to get a high amount of BO traits on any specific lion, especially one with a special base. To me, part of the reason why special lionesses are so special is because you can't just apply half of the markings: it makes them unique.

That being said, I wouldn't necessarily oppose some RLs having less BO markings than they currently have if there are multiple RLs per week, as long as some RLs still have mostly BO traits. I just think a hard limit of 5 BO markings per design would take away a lot of what people like about RLs.

I think one way to get around RLs looking kinda same-y could be continuing to introduce more colors that have BO markings but don't look natural, like bushveld, red, and blue (and arguably fiery and lilac, since neither of those are particularly natural looking imo).

EDIT: I'm realizing now that you may have meant 5 bo markings minimum. If that's the case I feel a little silly lol



Edited on 09/10/21 @ 19:16:05 by Lionfish (#4551)

Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

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Posted on
2021-10-09 19:46:59
I answered this in BoB, but I'd be fine with more BO marks on RLs if there were more marking shapes and colors! More bright reds, purples, blues, more stripes, swirls, and spots! Right now most of the raffle lionesses that pass by look so samey, and not unique in aesthetic at all. ;0; right now I feel like they must introduce more app and piety marks to them to make them look better, or they're just going to keep putting out more and more that look very samey.

Definitely would change the 5 max if more BO shapes and colors are introduced tho!


Rox o' Lantern #BLM (#121082)


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Posted on
2021-10-09 20:02:13
Hi.

As far as Raffle Lioness designers, I believe at this time it is just Katze. I do not believe there are any other designers at this time.
Most designs were her or the community, before they closed submissions.

I have one comment about allowing designs again, and it's that the same problem will arise, even anonymously. The problem was that people were feeling entitled because they made the design. This can very well still happen whether it's anonymously or not.
Hiding who made the design does not stop someone from being entitled or claiming a design even if submitted privately.
In addition to that, I don't think it should be modbox that receives it. I feel like moderators get bombarded enough, and that with assumingly Katze being the only person who does the designs, that would be the wrong place.

I don't completely disagree with the idea of Raffle Studs or multiple raffle lionesses.
However, as an avid Wolvden player, I do notice that with only 400-500 active players a day, and a 50 player maximum of winners, I still have yet to win anything.
Markings, eyes, etc still took their sweet time to spread.
Maybe not as much time as one RL versus 50 people studding, I suppose...

Changing the entry to some food, or amusement or something doesn't change anything regarding winners and RLs going inactive.
Unless this is just for fun, then sure, harmless I'd say honestly.
Edit: Lore would be cool though. Harmless to say the least, and might spark something in a winner to give them some lore and something to inspire them to hang around a little longer?

I'm iffy on the rolling the day before and after comment though. I feel like even if the person is the most inactive person in the world, they still fairly entered in to win her, and shouldn't be excluded if life gets busy.
From experience, one RL winner expressed to me that they were just so busy irl and could barely get on Lioden anymore, and just gave her to me.
I remember people being sad she went to an inactive account, but it just gave me a different perspective of the winner's POV.



Edited on 09/10/21 @ 20:03:14 by Rox o' Lantern #BLM (#121082)

NocturnalGoth (#180242)

Cursed
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Posted on
2021-10-09 20:16:01
I support pretty much everything on the thread and believe it is a step in the right direction. But I do understand concerns people may have.

While I do understand the concerns about the safeguard against inactive accounts, I feel like it’d be nice to have, perhaps maybe bump up the deal to rolling within three days or a week at most of winning the RL so they still have a chance to claim her if they win her and then once she's on their account they do whatever they would like with her.

As for people who feel entitled to getting RL's they designed, I feel like that is a case where their designs just are not accepted anymore if there is an incident.

Most problems that I have seen or am aware of come back to the lack of diversity and the small number of RLs versuses the large player base.

I'm pretty excited about the idea of more RL's and RL diversity and RL studs as I think it can be a good way to add some diversity in or help revive dying or extinct marks and slots or spread semi-rare to rare slots. I'd love to see both natural and more fantasy or bold lions and everything in between. So I overall support this and similar threads and would be interested in seeing if there's a way to implement the ideas in a manner that most of the community can be content with.



Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

Interstellar
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Posted on
2021-10-09 20:24:32
A fun aside! I was just going through some old Raffle Lionesses just for kicks, because I remembered that many years ago, they were not all BO as they often are now; and I was honestly surprised that many of them hardly had any BO markings at all! Now this could be because there weren't that many BO markings back then and they were - at that time - attempting to avoid very samey designs within the small parameters of what few marking colors and such they had, but I just wanted to share how gorgeous some of these old-timey classics were despite the fact they had few BO traits.

900gR5Q.png
This lady I found to be really unique in that she not only is pretty, but has THREE markings in total... that's it! They're all BO so a bit of an outlier, but three whole marks!!

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This pretty had three BO marks as well, and seven non-BO marks!

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This one is GORGEOUS and still had 4 common marks!

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This one made me giggle because I did a double-take; super pretty, but no BO marks! However, she had a Lilac base!

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This pretty only had 4 BO marks!

PurjZIF.png
I am absolutely in love with this one, and she only had 3 BO marks!

My point is - dropping the level of BO in RLs to focus on aesthetic qualities and dim down the ratrace of overbearing value is definitely not a new thing. It'd be - sortof - returning to LD roots regarding raffle lionesses, and I don't think that's a bad thing. ^^

EDIT:
OKAY TWO MORE I CANNOT RESIST I LOVE THEM

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Only 2 BO marks and an absolute STUNNER! I'd kill for this feline. ;A;

XKSvISC.png
and this Pearl with 2 BO marks!



Edited on 09/10/21 @ 20:27:59 by Verridith [g1 striped stellar] (#407)

🌿 whales0ng (#162699)


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Posted on
2021-10-13 09:34:39
I’d like to second the disagreement with the limit on 5BO marks, as we have so many more now and it’s part of what makes the lionesses so special!
A possible solution for the inactive accounts issue could be some sort of acceptance system, perhaps? Say a winner has 72 hours to roll and press a button to accept their RL before the drawing is re-rolled and passed to the next person drawn, like how it is done if a winner has no free territory to accept her. There would definitely have to be no way for the first winner to know that they’d originally drawn and missed their chance, though, again just like the full territory issue. I think there’s been a suggestion for this made!


Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

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Posted on
2021-10-13 09:46:45
I'm gonna leave the limit in my suggestion but of course it's up to the admins whether they take any of this or not xD

But that's a good idea! I'll add it in! ^^ If you can find the OG suggestion topic if there is one, can you toss it at me?


🌿 whales0ng (#162699)


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Posted on
2021-10-13 09:50:58
Here’s the original suggestion that covers part of my addition! ❤️
https://www.lioden.com/topic.php?id=304429256164&page=1


Verridith [g1
striped stellar] (#407)

Interstellar
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Posted on
2021-10-13 09:54:31
Thank you!! Adding that in!