Posted by SB Reward for Chasing

Camphor [Skyward
1.7k Clean] (#12577)


View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 18:26:14
I was thinking about ways that other sites keep the breeding population down, and a release reward seems to be pretty effective. Please excuse me if this has already been suggested.

On Lioden, I imagine it would be a randomized small payout of 10-50SB for chasing any lion under 3 years. The age limit prevents players from impressing NCLs purely for the sake of chasing them to get SB, but also allows the player to have a look at the lion's grown up form before making a decision.

While it doesn't decrease the breeding rate, it would essentially put a price floor on cubs and adolescents and increase the incentive to chase them instead of trying to hold out for a buyer.

It probably won't increase the breeding rate either. Since there's no cost for junk breeding to your own male right now, I assume that players are already breeding at the maximum rate, and then trying to sell the cubs, which means it can't go up even if there's more incentive to breed.

On the whole, I expect the feature to do more good for the economy than harm.

Modification: Breeding Fee
In order to combat inflation, a breeding fee paid by the owner of the female to the site can be implemented. If the breeding fee is greater than the average SB gain from chasing a litter of cubs, no inflation will occur. If the breeding fee is greater, deflation will occur.

In addition, a breeding fee will discourage users from junk breeding, decreasing the total number of cubs born, and encourage players to chase their own cubs instead of trying to sell them, in order to make back the cost of the breeding.



This suggestion has 4 supports and 0 NO supports.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Edited on 07/07/14 by Springdragon (#12577)

Axel (#6627)

Pervert
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 18:29:24
This had been brought up in official suggestions and was declined by the developers to sell cubs to NPCs for SB.
SB is overflowing, we have too much and dont need more source for it. We need to spend them.

Mass-breeders would gain extreme profit from this and would get rich by gaining cheap money. This would speed up the already horrible SB inflation.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Camphor [Skyward
1.7k Clean] (#12577)


View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 18:52:40
Really? The inflation here isn't nearly as bad as what I've seen in other places, but perhaps that's because Lioden is relatively small.

Inflation in games happens whenever the user to user market is stronger than the user to site market. The amount of SB being generated by normal gameplay is greater than the amount being spent on site items. Since SB traded to other players stays in circulation, a huge cub market increases the incentive to hoard SB instead of spending on site items.

However, we can also turn the problem upside down and implement a fee for breeding at the same time. Let's say, 50SB, paid by the owner of the female. Then, when the cubs are born, each of them generates 10-20SB at chasing. If average litter is 2 cubs, an average of 20SB will be taken out of circulation for every breeding, but the player can't sell the cubs for less than 10SB, or someone else will get the benefit from chasing.

There, fix both problems at once.




Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

EasyPlesi (#23249)

King of the Jungle
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 18:56:36
Sorry, no support for the reasons stated by Axel. I'm sure nobody would want to pay a fee for breeding (especially after paying a studding fee) and new members as well. They start about with 100 sb and the first thing they are going to do is buy and breed, it would just complicate things in my opinion.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Axel (#6627)

Pervert
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 19:10:42
I am well aware of why the inflation is bad, and know that items/features for SB would solve this somewhat, but now if you implement such an SB source, you will end up regenerating this inflation, giving people cheap money.

Mass-breeders would profit from it tenfold.
They usually produce about 20-30-40 cubs at once, and if they get 10SB for each... 200-300-400SB is their profit after 3 days... They dont even need to play the game to gain money. If you raise the price, then it will be only worse.

It would very quickly backfire as well. Think about it... if easy money can be acquired, then most of Lioden would jump at the opportunity and will start breeding to get the money, overflowing the market with excess SB.

Not to mention that maybe you can sell these cubs to the NPC, the people would still put them up for sale on the market to see if they can get more for it than from the NPC. You would achieve the opposite of what you intend. There will be more cubs instead of less.

Do NOT give rewards for excess breeding or everyone will go for it.

The developers noticed this problem and will not implement such a feature, we were reassured about it. Too many problems, too easy to abuse and exploit, and would cause more harm to the market than good.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Camphor [Skyward
1.7k Clean] (#12577)


View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 19:16:48
Ah yes, players generally don't like fees.

I suppose it depends on the player's view of time and probability.

If we set it up so that the average SB gain from chasing a litter is equal to the SB loss from the breeding, most players should be able to see that breeding is free if you don't like the cubs. You only have to pay the fee if you want to keep cubs. Otherwise, you get it back when chasing them.

However, since it's set up as a randomized number, there is a possibility for an individual player to get lucky with a breeding, and gain a profit from that particular breeding, which is something players get excited about, and are generally willing to accept.

For the site as a whole, and for mass breeders, who are only affected by averages, there is no gain, which will not cause inflation.

Edit for Axel:

If the total amount of SB that goes out is equal to the total amount of SB that goes in, nothing is going to change and there will be no inflation. Mass breeders will not profit, they will break even because they have to pay the breeding fee.

Nothing is preventing people from mass breeding right now because there is no cost, and there is a chance to benefit by selling the cubs for a pittance. Breeding is already happening at the maximum rate. Therefore, it cannot increase.

My aim was to put a price floor on cubs, not to prevent them from being sold at all. There is still the 2 year space limitation and a 3 year limit on the chase payout.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?


Edited on 07/07/14 by Springdragon (#12577)

Axel (#6627)

Pervert
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 19:33:08
You forget that people would never agree to an idea where you need to pay to breed. That is not the problem. The problem is that cubs are all too easy to acquire and keep alive. You dont even need to interact with them for them to survive.

The developers already came up with cub mortality and the Survival bar which should curb the market, making it harder to take care of excessive amounts of cubs daily.
Plus that feature would not punish people who breed for just their own pride. They would need to pay too in your full suggestion. Me too, even if I just breed my next gen of hunters. I am not at fault for what is happening on the market.... So why shall I be punished to having to pay, with no way to get back the money... Only if I chase my cubs which I need...

Very badly thought out. I have faith in this Survival Bar, it will solve everything quickly. They just need to implement it.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Camphor [Skyward
1.7k Clean] (#12577)


View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 20:01:28
Assuming a player sleeps for 8 hours and plays Lioden constantly, no more than three sets of five hunters can be used for free. That is 15 lionesses, each of which cost an average of 25SB and lasts for 13 years, or 156 days.

I do not think it would be incredibly difficult to obtain 375SB in 5 months. Plus, that 375SB fee will combat inflation, which is a good thing.

While cub survival is a great idea and adds a lot to the game, it only decreases the size of large breeding operations to a more manageable level. Therefore, as the site gets larger, the problem will resurface with many breeders generating a smaller average number of cubs each.

It would be great if cub mortality fixed the problem, but this is a much cheaper and less coding intensive solution in case it doesn't.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Axel (#6627)

Pervert
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2014-07-06 23:13:20
I have better means to spend that 375SB. So no, thank you. I have maybe other stuff to spend it on. And again a fee would punish everyone equally. You dont want people complaining because they have to pay to breed. You have to pay to stud. But in-pride breeding? No.

But I dont understand your view on the 'site getting larger and the problem will resurface'. The Survival Bar will completely stop mass-breeding, maybe only a few very dedicated players will go through taking care in multiple ways to 20-30 cubs a day for 12 days.
As the site grows larger, the breeding accounts might grow, but so do the buyers. Significantly less cubs will be added to the market. If members join, and maybe supply will grow, but also demand. Keep it in mind. The problem would not resurface, as both sides of the market will have added weight.

And again, I repeat... The developers strictly declined SB rewards for chasing cubs/lions. So maybe this SB reward would be cheaper but it would destroy the game. I rather see an effective method.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?







Memory Used: 623.45 KB - Queries: 0 - Query Time: 0.00000 - Total Time: 0.76243s