Posted by co-leading males rare occurance!

sburbplayer
~challenge me!~ (#53095)

Incredible
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Posted on
2015-01-18 01:16:52
Sometimes (very rarely) in the wild two lions co-lead. Sound far-fetched? I didn't believe until I watched documentary about it.

There are two different times when this happens very briefly during a coalition or a longer bond between two brothers.

A coalition happens when males without a pride work together for a common goal. I see no real way this can be implemented into the game other than roleplay.

A bond between two brothers could be implemented easier though. In the documentary I watched, the two lions were chased from their pride once they reached age. They then worked together and claimed a pride. They had small spats, but never tried to push the other from position. Unfortunately one of the two didn't make it out of a battle.

If this is implemented, it'd have to be a rare occurannce and there's have to be certain requirements such as:

The two males must be brothers (from the same male not female)
They can only take their fathers position together. (You can't trade them and have them take over. An unrelated kings pride)
If they try to take over an unrelated kings pride, only one will be king.
OR
The males could be similar in stats and age and take over any males pride
OR
Identical twins (as suggested by Miss Whispermouse) could be a rare occurance like (not an actual) mutation. If one is chosen to lead the pride, the other will/might follow.

As dual-Kings they can both be studded, impregnate females, and chase/kill lions, battle, and anything a previous lion could do.

Dual battles is out of the question for right now. It'd make this a lot harder to code. There's a thread already about bringing a lion/lioness into battle here -> http://www.lioden.com/topic.php?id=285884430000 Without its approval it's unlikely to have the dual-Kings fight alongside eachother. As of now, you'd simply be given a choice of which lion to battle.

I will link the documentary as sound as I find it again!

Feel free to leave any questions comments or concerns!

current cons:
-could hurt economy
-sub male breeding has been rejected many times

current pros:
-more realistic atmosphere
-more variety
-very flexible idea

suggestions:
"I think studding is what's causing the issue here, so what if you can only stud out one king to the public? But then you can have two lions to make babies with in your den but only earn sb from one of them? " ~Tasha

"Maybe it would work better if it went something like: any breeding attempts to your own lionesses and any stud requests are sent to /both/ kings, and its basically a dice roll which one impregnates the female? Or if she has multiple cubs, some could be sired by one king, and another by the other. If that makes sense? Basically the idea being that both males breed with her, and its random who's "stuff" ends up making the babies." ~Miss Whispermouse

"Or, another possible solution, its bred like a mutation, only its "twins" and they have identical markings/stats and only they can take over a pride together? So its still super rare, and there's not really an advantage because they'd be identical in every way. Any customization would happen to both of them so they stayed identical?" ~Miss Whispermouse (good idea! Identical twins!)



This suggestion has 47 supports and 0 NO supports.



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Edited on 18/01/15 by sburbplayer (#53095)

Whispermouse (#42554)

Terrifying
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Posted on
2015-01-18 03:32:07
Not saying that it was an actual mutation, just that it was treated as such by the game. And the odds are supposed to be low, that's the point. (That said, I've gotten two male cubs before, but still haven't gotten a mut)



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Larvirawr (#27485)

Dreamboat of Ladies
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Posted on
2015-01-18 05:41:35
What about they could if they were born with the exact same looks? (It's rare for TWO MALES to be born with the same markings, so people would have to breed markingless for this) That way you'd have to customize the crap out of them in order for them to be good looking, but you'd have two males...

Just a thought. It came to my mind just now so I haven't uh... really thought about it seriously but uhh xD



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🚒FireFlye🚑~SFD
~ (#52391)

Prince of Terror
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Posted on
2015-01-19 01:09:47
I got two males that were nearly identical in marks and if you couldn't see the Mark percentages, you would think they we're exactly the same. I'm supporting this. I see no reason why it isn't plausible in the game.



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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-01-20 00:44:03
I am afraid I cannot support this.

Reasons:
1. So this would be rare? Not everyone could get that? Unfair to majority and those who cannot have two males.
2. Studding both would increase the amount of cubs. The stud limit per week is there for a very good reason.
3. You can have two kinds of males, customized or special. If you want to switch design you can just stud the other at any time. less income for the site because you dont need to buy customization if you want anything new and less income for the rest of the players because you wont need the help of others.
4. How would battling even work? Which gets the exp? Impression? Which one claims the females in explore?
5. Which also means that those who are lucky to have double males will have the advantage and 100% win the NPC battles and PVP battles.
6. This means basically double explore. Which means double found items, carcasses, double SB, double karma interactions, double everything. Not good.
7. Plain and simply having two males would be basically the same as having the submale breed. Two males equal a lot of advantage. Which I am sure the site doesnt want to give us.
8. To me this idea looks like someone is attempting to find cheap ways to get more males they can stud to free or at least have a potential choice while bypassing the submale slots. Because having 4 submale slots would need GB. This idea simply has no other use than giving more breeding resources which our economy doesnt need. Once the balance is found it should stay that way. This would cause another ruckus.

While it is realistic, I am afraid Lioden was not made to accommodate such an idea. Having two males would be too great of an advantage in explore, studding, breeding, PVP, NPC fights.


Addressing some concerns and questions:
Submales are supposed to not do anything. The slots were implemented to make take-over easier. Before this you had to have luck that a male cub under 2 years was in your den to retire to it or else you had to reroll the lion.

Just because it happens in real life doesnt mean it will be beneficial to the game. It would cause a lot of income loss, and unfair advantages to those with two males.

If only one can stud will not solve the issue, especially because there is always old-fashioned studding. It promotes scam. Also a lot of mass-breeders breed their own males anyway. This still means far more cubs.

Just my two cents.



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sburbplayer
~challenge me!~ (#53095)

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Posted on
2015-01-20 01:43:32
@Axel
So it's rare? Mutations are rare. You have to have a very low female to get one of those and they are hard to come by.

I mentioned that before it comes up there would be no double exp. If one lion is out the other can't continue. I'm hoping there could be an option to choose which lion to battle, explore, PvP, etc.

This idea was not meant for breeding. Maybe the lions could be infertile? That would cause players to stud others lions for Cubs.

It has already been suggested that the lions could look the same like identical twins. This wouldn't matter if they are infertile though. The only change between them would be stats, level, and karma. Maybe looks.

There could be a fallback option that if one lions stats are way too high over the others one will be chased.






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Axel (#6627)

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Posted on
2015-01-20 01:45:50
But then why implement it if the other male doesnt do anything? What use would it have?

The difference between this and mutations is that mutations dont have an impact on your gameplay. Whereas male lions do.



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sburbplayer
~challenge me!~ (#53095)

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Posted on
2015-01-20 20:39:03
I'm really tired rn so I'm gonna answer later.



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