Posted by Environmentalism may be too preachy

Archangel (#176048)

Deathlord of the Jungle
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-11 00:13:28
I love this game.

But I play it to avoid political issues, escape reality for a bit, imagine that I am a lion in charge of my own pride, not to become more involved with political issues, especially if I am presented with something I don't agree with politically.

Killing damn poachers is fine, very few people will side with a poacher, but not so sure about my lion being upset with farmers clearing their land. There are many starving people in Africa. Children die every day. This, on a continent with more unused arable land than anywhere else in tbe world. Farming in Africa fights rampant starvation there. Showing the humans burning in the dry season is inaccurate anyway, and implies that all the fires in tbe game are caused by humans. As we all are aware, most are not.

I think at the very least my lion should have the opportunity to say "Hmph...humans have to eat too."

I haven't seen the other environmental encounters, but I hope that they aren't as preachy and virtue signalling as the one with humans clearing for crops. Such things bring real-life issues into an otherwise fantastic and wonderful game that many of us play as a break from reality.

Thank you guys!




This suggestion has 10 supports and 154 NO supports.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Nanabana (it/its) (#179598)

Ruthless
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-11 00:45:20
No support.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Emerald (#15750)

Deathlord of the Jungle
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-11 00:56:09
The game's BEEN bringing RL issues into it alongside the fantasy. Famine, flooding, anti-poaching, and this month's drought, all been here, this is no different. Environmental stuff regarding pollution and littering isn't even that different really, it like everything else I listed IS a thing that happens in the wild, and you're playing a lion living in the wild. While Lioden does have a lot of fantasy to it that doesn't mean they should just shove off the realistic entirely. Even when you're blue sparkly star furred and decking out shamistic wears you're still, at it's base, a lion living in the wilds.

It's not "preachy virtue-signaling". It's nature, and nature can and will be harsh.

Anyways. No support.

EDIT: Oh yeah and burning land to clear it for farms, and even to just burn WASTE, even worse. That can spread fast and go from a small flame to a massive fire that can ruin the habitat and make it inhospitable with all its smoke and heat and stuff. Your lion WOULD be upset (And shows to be if you watch the fires burn) about farmers "clearing" their land and burning shit with no regard if they are going about such out-there and dangerous ways. They're being irresponsible to the land they're on, not even caring that it hurts those that inhabit it, that's the whole POINT of those encounters. Saying "People need to eat too" just kinda shows you missed the point of it entirely tbh.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?


Edited on 11/08/19 @ 14:57:04 by Emerald (#15750)

Mad Hyena (#29080)

Special Snowflake
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-11 00:57:28
No support.
Clearing out land for a farm is fine - even putting aside all other arguments, there IS an encounter of farmer fixing a fence of their farm that your lion can kill or leave alone, that farmer is a good man - BUT dry season or no, its NOT fine to BURN fields!

Burning is easy and fast way that LAZY farmers use so they dont have to work cleaning the land. It takes but a few minutes rather than few days of work to burn a field down rather than have to work pulling all the weeds. But it is a source of a giant hunk of forest fires, this irresponsible way of clearing the land - it is actually forbidden in most countries, including african countries, BUT people do that anyway, because quick and easy. Fires started on one small field move onto giant territories of wild lands - but farmers dont care, they cleaned their field and they dont care how much of other land burns away with it, as long as it moves away from their settlement it doesnt concern them. That is what Lioden is raising awareness to, how much being irresponsible and seeking out easy ways of solving your problems can hurt nature around you.

So the argument "people need to eat too" isnt very valid here, as you missed the point of the encounter. It's not bad people are cleaning a land for a farm - it is bad they're burning it. If they were honest working people pulling those weeds out, then our lions wouldnt have any problems with them (and likely, never even notice them doing that). Those pulled weeds can be used to feed cattle, so if those people were truly in dire need, they would not burn them down!



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?


Edited on 11/08/19 @ 01:18:58 by Mad Hyena (#29080)

Beck (#175367)

King of the Jungle
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-24 18:39:53
"I play Lioden to avoid political issues"

there's your problem. no offense meant, pal, but lioden has had political themes relating to environmentalism, conservation, and humanity's responsibility for what it does to the world around it since its inception. i don't think the game needs to be restructured and have countless pieces of content cut from it just because some people have decided these things are "virtue signaling". just enjoy the parts of the game entirely separate from politics, which is, like, 99% of them.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Jarat (#50123)

Interstellar
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-24 23:14:07
"Killing damn poachers is fine, very few people will side with a poacher, but not so sure about my lion being upset with farmers clearing their land --"

Poachers or not (because I wouldn't wish death-by-lion on anyone), the sheer amount of slaughter the game encourages against humans (including innocents by tying it to a major event shop) leaves a bad taste in my mouth. This goes beyond just lions being upset; there is a ton of casual, even unwarranted violence against people that seems to just get ignored in favor of "oh, the poor stork". This simply feels like a guilt-the-players-for-being-human month in every aspect, and I am not a fan. (Especially because it is so boring and one-sided. If the Preserver shop did more to encourage the idea that there are people trying to help the situation, it wouldn't be so bad, but it doesn't.)



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Richie (#67745)

Divine
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 00:12:15
In no way is the game promoting genuine violence against humans, in the same way other media that involves the senseless slaughtering of humans doesn't promote it. To be fair, the slaughtering of humans is a genuine option real lions do have in real life. It's not commonplace by any means, so for the game it's simply a game mechanic and storyline tool and should therefore be treated as such. You viewing it as the promotion of human slaughter is more a you problem than anything else.

That being said, regarding OP... This is a game based in and adapted from reality for the purpose of gameplay. You are a lion in the wild, dealing with the various curveballs life throws your way that won't discriminate against your angel wings or fire-hot toes, a lot of which where the pitcher happens to be human. From the perspective of a lion, humans suck.
The point of this shit isn't to guilt us for being human (remember, the team behind the game are, also, a bunch of humans) but rather to make us self-aware about the preventable issues we all contribute to. If you're feeling guilty then you probably need to take a look into why that is. Don't blame a SIM game for it.
Lioden doesn't have a political bias on most things, the one thing it has and will always have a stance on is environmentalism. It's part of the charm of the game and the community.
It's a good thing Lioden is bringing attention to the utilization of slash-and-burn clearing too, seeing as that's what has caused the Amazon to burn these past couple of weeks. This is an issue that, of all things, really needs attention and really needs a solution presented to solve and prevent this problem from reoccurring.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?


Edited on 25/08/19 @ 00:15:03 by Tacenda (#67745)

Jarat (#50123)

Interstellar
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 00:26:40
The "good" humanity can and does do is not given nearly the weight the "bad" is, nor the appreciation from our sentient-lion avatars that it deserves. This month piles on the negatives and gives us next to nothing to counter-balance it.
Of course the game isn't encouraging actual violence, but it is encouraging _our avatars_ to kill innocent humans. There is a major event function locked behind killing thousands of humans, whether they are doing anything wrong or not.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Richie (#67745)

Divine
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 00:52:08
That reflects reality. The good humanity does for the environment and our coexistence with other species in real life does not have nearly the same weight as the bad humanity does. It exists, just as it does in-game, but the bad things simply occur more than the good things. We do have some events that acknowledge humans who are trying to put out the fires and trying to find water sources.
Our lions killing innocent humans is just as much a nonexistent issue as our lions killing innocent bunnies. No one is hurt, nothing graphic is shown. It is, again, simply a gameplay mechanic and one that works. I would see there being an issue if the game promoted actual violence, but as you said, it doesn't. So, forgive my ignorance, what's the issue here?



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

(Frozen!) Micah
🌈✨ (#58378)

Divine
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 00:53:21
No support for all the reasons already stated



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Mwothman (#138189)

Spicy
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:08:20
No support, for all the reasons stated



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Jarat (#50123)

Interstellar
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:09:05
Innocent bunnies are less important then innocent people. The weight of vast numbers of people being (conceptually) killed is not being acknowledged, making it seem cheap and meaningless. That is the issue. Killing innocent people is being _encouraged_ to complete the event.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Richie (#67745)

Divine
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:20:28
Innocent bunnies are as important to a wild lion as innocent humans are. Anyone with any common sense knows that a human life is valuable, but again, none of these humans are real and that means that, in this particular instance, there needs to be a separation of reality. Lioden is actually tame when it comes to games and killing innocent people.
To me, there really isn't an issue here.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Jarat (#50123)

Interstellar
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:27:30
And it's fine for you to think that, but to me it _is_ an issue. A big one, and one I will talk about without shame. Human life is precious, and to see _humans_ putting us in a situation where the loss of human life (not literally, but as a concept) as something to push a counter and get a reward is disturbing.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Mwothman (#138189)

Spicy
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:31:17
@Jarat

If you don't want to participate in the event then you don't. There is no need to push for a change on a lion simulation game. I am aware all life is precious but these are not real humans. If they were just put ourselves in the place of our avatars.

We have no food, there are fires everywhere and trash is killing off our prey. The lionesses aren't catching as much and your desperate.

Humans will always choose themselves over self preservation- even against other humans. I fail to see how it suddenly changes when we play as pixelated lions.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?

Jarat (#50123)

Interstellar
View Forum Posts


Posted on
2019-08-25 01:33:58
I was stating my opinion on how this event is going too far, adding to the point made by the original poster my own complaints with this event. I'm not saying any pixel-man dying is a bad, evil thing, I am saying that this event is pushing it too far.



Hrt Icon 0 players like this post! Like?







Memory Used: 639.91 KB - Queries: 0 - Query Time: 0.00000 - Total Time: 0.00424s