That sounds like a good strategy, Fart :o

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Totally support this. Raising the bars is out of order when we've worked damn hard to unlock them.

I've noticed some similarities between this and the buff-balls-to-700-DB fiasco, in that people who support those changes are using the same flawed reasoning now as they did last month - 'if you want something, you have to work hard for it'. That's all well and good, but the thing is, we ARE working hard to unlock the bars. We explore our asses off, and sometimes we forgo the options that give us JB in favour of the options that will kill more locusts. It's hard to stay motivated when the goalposts keep getting moved, but we do it.

In short: people saying that we shouldn't complain about the bars being lifted because 'work harder, children!' is horrendously patronising and just plain wrong. It's like two people working the same job, the same gruelling hours, the same hard manual labour, and yet Person A is paid twice as much as Person B. Does this mean Person A works harder? Does it mean Person B is slacking? No, it means that the reward being given is different for whatever reason, but it sure as hell doesn't mean that Person B isn't working hard.

That said, we're already almost halfway to unlocking Tier 2 of the locust shop and it's only the 4th of the month, so credit to the admins if they allow us to complete the bars as fast as we currently are, as it shows our opinions are being taken on board.

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"I think you're forgetting that Lioden is still in beta phase"

People have been trying to use this as an excuse every single time an issue pops up and I'm pretty over it. "Umm, guys, beta????" isn't something you can use to deflect criticism every time something happens. That's just not how these things work. Heda already kind of hit the nail on the head for me, though. "Beta" really means jack shit at this point. Really.

Also, it has nothing to do with it being a "challenge", but it has everything to do with them mistaking how high the tier should be and then swiping it away (and probably also the content not even being finished for said tier), typically at the last second, when we're about to unlock it. This happens all the time and has happened for as long as I can remember. If we're unlocking things as a community achievement, and we're unlocking them at an alarming pace, don't take it away. The entire idea behind the progress bars is that they're community progress. Don't punish the community for something they're meant to do.

Personally it seems to me that the drop rate on JB was also dropped but I can't really say for certain since I don't have enough sample evidence obviously. Oh well, not shocked if so.

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Just throwing my two cents in and saying that i've seen more people quitting and taking hiatuses lately than ever before, and i can assure you it's not because this site is open cupcakes and sunshine. I would go as far as saying that Finnegan's suggestion was marked as "added to the game" so that people would stop talking about it and it wouldn't get the same backlash as it would if they had just locked it.

There's absolutely no point in having events like this if you don't take the userbase into consideration. The people who fund the site and play the site are the ones who the content is intended for, so why fix problems that arent broken?

I also agree with thalath. The constant "Beta???" excuse is getting kinda tiring. If the site being in "beta???" is an issue, then maybe they should focus on fixing content + bugs and updating markings instead of pushing event bars and adding more bullshit we don't need like extra marking slots and battle beetles

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"I would go as far as saying that Finnegan's suggestion was marked as "added to the game" so that people would stop talking about it and it wouldn't get the same backlash as it would if they had just locked it."

We all know this is exactly what happened. You do, I do.

They locked it and "added it to the game" without any intentions to actually change the ridiculous way they conduct their affairs during events so that we'd shut up, and they'll just continue on as they always have regardless of what we think. I'll throw my support in here, but honestly, Sync, don't expect anything more than a patronizing pat on the head and another lie in return.

I'm not even going to comment on the "beta" angle, which is so far beyond ridiculous it doesn't even bear discussion.

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I love how when something is unfair the whole 'Then you have to work harder' argument comes up. its the same thing people use to distract from unfair payment issues or from issues of social inequality. You say that this or that is unfair and bring a totally sound reason as to why and they just "Oh.. what? so you get less payout even you work the same stuff and the same times as your co-worker? LOL just work harder!" ... As if getting 3 badly paid jobs actually would solve the issue.

Nope. This isn't about working harder or being lazy. This is about getting exactly what you worked for - adnd what was stated. Your boss isn't allowed to change your work contract after both of you signed it just because he doesn't like the conditions anymore. Neither should lioden get to up or lower the amout of stuff needed to unlock tires in a running phase.

If they start out with a plan like this: 1st tier = 20mill, 2nd tier = 50mill and 3rd tier 100 mill and then realize tant this is to low instead of changing the 1st tier bar they can just adjust the following still hidden bars. So if they realize that we are pushing to the 20million 'too early' for their liking they are free to up the still hidden tiers to 80million and 150 million without showing their old plans.

And as someone said.. After 5 years of running this game you should have a more or less working statisitk of how many active users there are for each month, the data about playerincrease per registration (which I asume to be somewhat steady over the months) and how much each player on average plays into the evens unlocking box.

This is how admins on other games calculate events and have been doing for many years. And usually rather successfully. Not that you need to get an exact number out of this calculation. But at least you get an idea on if 20 million is too low, too high or about the right amout of numbers needed. With such a playercalculation you can estimate on if a bar will unlock within a day or within a week - depending on the numbers we play with here I'd say you can get as close to detemining the exacte date something is unlocked if your model fits and your playerbase is big enough to compensate fluctuations.

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Oh god, I was WONDERING what had happened. I saw it go up and thought we unlocked the tier, but since it didn't I was confused and wondering if we needed to get past an unopen one first. It never even occurred to me that they moved the goalposts because the sites I go on don't do that. What the HELL.

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Since we're at it, can we make a side note on the prices of items changing? For example, if the price of an item is going to change just state it outright. Not this "prices may change" nonsense and backpedal when people are reasonably upset.

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On the fence about this one.

Honestly- I don't mind when they adjust the price on Day 1 of an event. I can only imagine how hard it is to try and calculate a good number for tiers to unlock with data that is a year old. Since every event is different and the number of event encounters and rate of ___ gain is all different they can't even rely on data from the previous months event.

Adjusting the prices a week or two into an event is another matter entirely though.

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@Maiq the Hoarder
Don't forget that they apparently increased the last tier of an event, then refused to unlock it once it couldn't be met, so I'd err on the side of "no adjustments" because of that. (Otherwise I'd agree with you)

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I don't know when that supposedly happened. 2016 April I guess? That's the only event I know of where we didn't open all the tiers and the Staff refused to open it. And they refused because there were more than enough eggs in the game to open the tier and people just didn't donate them.

(Yes, this account wasn't created yet at that point, but my main was. Nor do I know for certain that that event had the tier numbers increased.)

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@Maiq the Hoarder
The rabbit event. I've seen news about it around (and I think even in this very thread?). To be honest, though? I don't blame people for not donating them. It's incredibly demoralizing to work hard, then find that you worked TOO hard and things were taken away.

As I said, I do agree that Day 1 (hell, I'd even say up to Day 3) SHOULD be cause for adjustments. But if you're going to do that? BE TRANSPARENT ABOUT IT. Make a news post about it. I didn't actually KNOW the goal had been shifted until I saw this, because -- yep -- the staff were silent. I thought this event was weird where you had to fill the bar up at least once before you actually got to unlocking. And if you have to adjust it past that, someone had a great suggestion: adjust the hidden tiers. The ones players haven't seen yet. Yeah, it might be a major spike, but if they got the one before it fast, they'd understand. And it DOESN'T move the goalposts.

For the donations... If the staff is outright goalpost moving, why WOULD you donate? What if they decided to move it AGAIN? If it was a matter of donating items, ESPECIALLY at the end of the month? Yeah, I wouldn't donate either, for fear the items would just be GONE because they decided "nah, we're upping the work you have to do".

So I'm 100% on the side of people who didn't donate the eggs, because as far as I can tell? They had no guarantee the staff wouldn't move it AGAIN. And I personally know that, thanks to this, I'm going to be very sparse with donating anything of mine in such events until we have a solid goal (like we do now, the 90k) specifically to avoid the goalpost moving.

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Rabbits would be April. But it would have to have been last year because we did get them all open this year.

But ultimately we seem to be of the same mind. I don't have an issue with them adjusting things Very early in the event because they had to rely on year old data to set the goals.

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Support. It's honestly a pet peeve of mine if they want stuff to open on the same days every event every year then just do that what's even the point of the bars?

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