100000% agree with you all ;-; The fun of lioden always was and still is the hard work and getting results of it! If we make all applicable, that would turn into pay-to-win...

I really hope that our admins will listen to us. Pretty horrified with the amount of "yes" and generally with the idea....

This change would affect me personally (like many other players), since for over a year now I am trying to breed my heir with 4x celestial markings, including Celestial Agouti on rare slot 7. It costed me much work and GB and I didnt achieve it yet ;-; But I am enjoying every small step forward that I make. I cant imagine what are feeling those breeders that worked hard for many years and with many GB and real money spent to achieve their heirs and seeing this ridiculous idea now :c

With the apps it all would be ruined, my work and my future king value would drop down terribly. Those markings might be "old", but they are still desireable, just because they are beautiful AND breed only. Just like white vitiligos and some of the felines.

If people desire so much those celestial speckles, just make app recolor or something similar, but please dont ruin efforts of all the hard working breeders D:

If the apps come alive, I am afraid that the game will lost many long-term players ;-; Me including :c

You have liked this post!

I can't imagine how much this decision would break the game for celestial marking breeders. Aplicators are a terrible idea and I fully support this post.

You have liked this post!

I feel like at this point staff are just determined to pander and take all difficulty/rarity out of them game.

IE: Interstellar app taken out of explore and this.

Support.

You have liked this post!

I'm posting here with my side account due to the fact that I have been breeding for celestial/skyward markings on this account for at least a year. This is my current progress on my stud.

Slot 2: Skyward Cover (53%)
Slot 3: Skyward Undercover (100%)
Slot 4: Celestial Speckles (100%)
Slot 5: Skyward Crumbing (32%)
Slot 7: Celestial Agouti (48%)
Slot 8: Celestial Cover (100%)
Slot 9: Skyward Shine (42%)

Each celestial marking took months of breeding and fighting a merciless rng to get on my stud. But the chance of Skyward/Celestial/Sidereal markings turning into applicators has completely killed my drive for this. I fully support this post.

You have liked this post!

Fuck you’re so close to a double quad too. That’s so much work.

You have liked this post!

I just recently bred my first ever full celestial. After days, no, YEARS and A LOT of breeding items. Also keep in mind I’ve been playing since 2013. I’ve had bad luck breeding but sense of accomplishment of completing that goal was amazing for me. The idea that anyone who has enough money can just poof one into existence is so gutting to me.

You have liked this post!

Agreed, a thousand times over.

My current breeding project has taken years upon years. To suddenly have newbies obtain celestial/sidereal/sidereal marked lions and lionesses would be a slapped to my efforts and money I put into my king.

It has taken me since the introduction of these markings to breed a x4 Celestial/ x2 Skyward/ x2 Sidereal marked lion; not to mention the golden beetles I had to spend to gather genetics for this project. And, despite my frustration with it, I kept diligently at it - even tho I have wanted time and time again to give up, and try something new. Knowing how much effort, time, and money went into this dream king has kept me from straying.

To have it suddenly become that more easy to create a "special" lion, where I put blood, sweat, and tears, would be a real low blow on Lioden's part.

You have liked this post!

I vote yes but i did not understood what they mean...sorry...but i support you because if what they mean was what you explain i agree with you

You have liked this post!

SUPPORT

I spent a long time breeding for quad marks and star shine eyes since i joined LD and finally got it, (even though i have taken off some of the marks from my king in the months since for more colour) and to have them turned into an app, suddenly, all that hard work would be for nothing if i could have gotten an applicator.
(I would rather that we keep the celestial/skyward/sideward markings as breed-only, but maybe tone down their rarity a bit to make room for new markings as well? Maybe celestial studs as a separate tab for these old marks would be a thing like the studs that come in other event/s, i don't know if it'd fit the lore, while new markings are put in the celestial lionesses. )

You have liked this post!

THIS.

You have liked this post!

What's really funny to me is that the way rarity is balanced in this game is terrible.

Breeding for specific bases is extremely punishing and rare to the point where it doesn't feel fun or rewarding. They won't do anything to help bases, i.e. Medium bases, pass slightly easier... but everything else is fair game for some reason? Things that are an appropriate amount of challenging, too. Breeding for markings feels like an appropriate, fun challenge. It takes time, but it doesn't feel like I'm making absolutely no progress when I do it. Bases are the opposite.

Everything on Lioden is either an absurdly difficult grindfest, or absurdly easy. There is no inbetween.

Granted, I understand difficulty balancing is hard, but... come on.

A bunch of bases are dead because they're way too annoying to breed and no one wants to breed them when there are tons of applicator bases that are just as "special". Same with markings. It's annoying. No one wants to breed something that is super hard and unfun to get when someone else can get the same rarity tier for minimal effort. Why take the time breeding for Sidereal when I could just put Hematite on my king for the exact same genetic category and specialness? People expect you to have 10 markings that will completely cover up the base anyway.

Special Lioness markings used to be a HUGE deal. Now it's like... meh, no one cares I guess.

You have liked this post!

I just wanted to pitch in and assuage some fears, if possible.

This being polled does not mean it is absolutely going to happen. The game developers are constantly trying to come up with ways to improve the game, make it more fun, give it a fresh feeling, etc. - thus the reason that game polls exist, so new ideas can be toyed around with before they're fully fleshed out.

From a staff point of view, it is extremely disheartening to see people theorise that we do not care about our players, that we want to ruin breeding projects, and make this game incredibly easy to play. That's not our intent. We decided to release this poll to gain feedback on the idea itself. There have been quite a few polls regarding an important change to a game mechanic or a potentially game-breaking new item being added in which the majority voted in favour of; however, they have never made it past the polling stage, and never actually became a "thing" - case in point, the Marking Slot Changer. This has been a heavily-requested item for years and years, but it doesn't exist in the game because the developers have paid attention to all of the discussions surrounding both the pros and the cons of such an item. Discussions like this are extremely important to have.

When we bring up these ideas, we hope to receive constructive feedback or discussions on why it shouldn't be implemented. This thread, for example, is a great example of constructive feedback. Verbal attacks and backlash do not contribute anything, and in fact are more harmful than helpful, as seeing certain commentary makes us less inclined to "think outside the box" and mention the ideas that we come up with. I cannot stress how much we do not want to upset anyone; we reflect on recent events, we have an idea, and we think, "Hey, I wonder what people would think of this?"

We value everyone's feedback. Regardless of the poll's outcome, I can definitely say that we've taken all commentary into account.

You have liked this post!

Katze, many, many of us feel crushed that this was even brought to a poll instead of just a thread to request feedback.

Polls feel more official, like there's no hope whatsoever if the vote swings in favor of destroying our breeding projects, which it has.

Your post does a lot of telling us what staff feels, but it does not help address the issue itself. Players are in a panic right now because everything they've built up on lioden might be ripped away, because markings that were originally intended to be permanently breed only might suddenly not be worth anything.

Applicators lead to worthless markings. Even the expensive apps do not produce markings that sell for more than a few SB. Breeding multi-july marked lions was a worthwhile project because not only are they pretty to look at, they held their value better through the years than other marks.

You must understand, as you see the game as y'all's pet project, which you work hard on, and the community also is a project of sorts with the public opinion of staff being the "value" in the work. The loss of that valuable good public opinion is disheartening as you've said. We are suffering the same.

You have liked this post!

^

You have liked this post!

No offence meant, Katze, but the fact the idea even has enough weight to the admins to be worth polling is part of what has us this upset.

It shouldn't take a poll to know that this would hurt the older userbase, people who have been on this site for years and invested time (and in many cases real money) into these markings. Why would people who invested heavily in Celestial, Skyward and Sidereal suddenly turn around an embrace changing them and removing part of what made them unique?

It shouldn't take a poll to know that of course newer players, or ones that already exclusively use applicators, will jump on the opportunity without thinking it through.

Understand that to us, it sure does look like you're prioritizing these members over the ones who already work for these markings, or the ones that work towards breeding any markings really. Understand that yes, people will get angry when an official poll implies their projects could become simple dyejobs. Our anger is valid, and please don't pull 'oh, we won't think outside the box next time' to try and make us feel guilty about it.

Yeah, it sucks that there was backlash- but I dare say it's merited, this idea should have been shot down before it was polled. Now the can of worms is open- on one hand, people will be wondering 'so we won the poll, when will we get the applicators?' and on the other, marking breeders now know that their projects could be turned to spending sprees at any time, they know admins considered turning their play style into nothing.

This might be a bad weekend for admins, but I know I've heard from a good handful of breeders who aren't as enthused about their projects anymore, Celestial or otherwise. I know I'm reconsidering mine, after Celestial has been the heart of this account for three-four years.

How many other users feel this way? No clue, but I'm glad enough of us could speak out to make you reconsider. Staff have made drastic, dramatic changes to projects without user feedback before, or ignoring it. DU nerf, because they should be more valuable than hybrids? The nerf to hybrid bases, Medium breeding? Double markings not passing was not intentional, but the thread to bring them back is two years old and has over six hundred supports, no word on if that's in the gameplan. We don't trust you to consider our feedback, and that's why we are so scared and so angry.

I'm sorry this is a bit of an essay, but that single damn poll has made my weekend one hell of a roller coaster, a nasty one for a lot of us. I articulated it as nicely as I could given the circumstances. <3

EDIT: some typos oops + the thread actually has over 600 supports

You have liked this post!