Posted by [ALL] Implement Date-Based Unlocking

Finnegan II (#85926)


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Posted on
2018-04-03 15:53:31
Note: If you have additional suggestions, I would be more than happy to add them, credited to you, to the main post. Thank you.

The Issue: Fragmented Community, Stressed Staff, Constant Adjustments
Every month, the Lioden community has the same argument: event tiers are messed up or different or too high or too low. Changes are prompted, resulting in malcontent from the community. This displeasure is aimed at the staff, who surely believe that they’re doing the right thing. That’s understandable. Sometimes you have to make changes that are unpopular for the good of the community as a whole.

But, at some point, we’re just making the same mistakes and having the same argument about tier requirements to unlock each shop every month. When the staff feels like shops are being unlocked too quickly, the tiers are increased. It’s hard to estimate the output of the player base, especially pre-empting the month in question, so estimations are often wrong.

When these estimations are wrong (which is often), adjustments are made that often upset a sizeable portion of the players, and for good reason! Players don’t like feeling that their hard work to unlock a tier doesn’t mean anything if the staff don’t want tiers to open before certain dates.

The Fix: Implement Date-Based Tier Unlocking
Currently, tiers are based on player participation. We have to kill a certain number of poachers or donate a certain number of eggs or defeat a certain number of rabid NPCs. It’s not easy to estimate how many players will be playing for any specific month, as interest in certain events and items varies widely, so setting these goals is difficult in the first place.

I would like to propose utilizing date-based tier unlocking instead. Let’s take April for example:
Tier 1 of the Bunny Shop and Egg Den would open on April 7th.
Tier 2 of the Bunny Shop and Egg Den would open on April 14th.
Tier 3 of the Bunny Shop and Egg Den would open on April 21st.

That gives players a full 10 days to enjoy the last tier and prepare for next month’s event, while spacing out tier openings throughout the month, giving everyone something to look forward and removing the anxiety that comes with checking tier progress every morning and wondering if we’ll even get to tier 3 this year.

Retaining Community Engagement and “Earning” Rewards: The Issue
Some opponents of this idea might assert that it is the duty of the community to “earn” their rewards in the shop by participating actively in the event to kill x number of NPCs or gather x number of eggs. Although I do not personally agree with this and would argue that forcing the community to “earn” rewards this way is actually forcing them to earn their rewards twice (communal unlocking of tiers AND earning the currency to purchase items in those tiers as an individual), I have a few suggestions regarding keeping the community engaged and actively interacting with events.

Retaining Community Engagement: Fix Suggestion - Quest Completion
With date-based unlocking implemented, staff members will no longer need to worry about focusing on estimating user activity for the upcoming month. This frees up some time to focus on implementing new quests and storylines for each month. I know I personally love the little quests and stories that come with certain months now, like Wenet in April and Angels vs. Demons in October. I think they’re great!

Rather than forcing players to donate their currency or kill a certain number of NPCs as a community before they can access the shop, force them to complete a certain portion of the event storyline.

For example, in April, players who haven’t completed “Crafting Bones” by April 7th cannot access the first tier of the shop or egg den until they complete “Crafting Bones”. Players who haven’t completed “Crafting Fur” by April 14th cannot access the second tier of the shop or egg den until they complete “Crafting Fur.” Players who haven’t completed “Carving the Future” by April 21st cannot access the third tier of the shop or egg den until they complete “Carving the Future.”

Additionally, this removes the very troublesome prospect of donating your event currency to access event shops, where you have to purchase items with event currency.

It gives casual players a chance to access all the shops as long as they actively engage with an event and its lore. It encourages the staff to add quests and lore to months that do not currently have them, which would be great! For those months, I would currently simply suggest using the “Date-Based Unlocking” system until quests can be added.

Conclusions and Addendums
If anyone has any additional or alternate suggestions or specific suggestions for any month, I’ll gladly add them here with a credit to the user who suggested them! If my suggestion is a little too extreme for you, please consider this suggestion , made by Heda RedBox.

Argryo (84746) on Questing Requirements
"If they'd make all storylines able to be completed within 3-4 days [I think it was like that with Laharu? A few parts you could do in a row, but a couple that require a day's wait] if you roll later in the month, but still not within a single day's time [gotta get a bit of activity, even if it's once a week!], then that'd be a perfect and really cute solution from my point of view! ^^

An extra 'unlocking the shop' series of quests way, way down the line, once every month has its storyline, could be an end goal; help the April rabbit mom find her babies to access her wares! Chart out the flooding to find the Flood Pit otter! Find the shaman lost in visions to access the Shaman Shop! Etc etc etc
And for more Storyline-related ideas, you could, say... Win a series of lil' scuffles with Nirah to access his goods!! Try your best to impress that Groupie who mans the shop with V'Kai's help or Vash's advice! Track down the chimps of the Carrion shop by following Laharu's trail!

I dunno, storyline unlocks could be really, really cute and fun, so long as they don't have too many Rollover requirements. ;D"

Moonie (138561) on Rollover Rewards for More Active Players
"Perhaps daily loggers could get extra perks for completing daily quests consecutively as well? Like the rollover where doing it for so many days in a row earns you a Lucky Foot, Vulture Egg, or a bit of SB? That way there would be more incentive to complete them each day but it wouldn't be a necessity."

Heda Vampiric (56702) on Quest Completion
"To note, on the quests, and Argryo touched on this, but if the quests are required to access the shop when it unlocks, people should be able to do more than one a day if they are behind.

1. So if a user is on every day, and do their daily quest without missing one, they only get one a day (because they are not behind), but if someone didn't start playing until say, day 6, they could do up to 6 quests that day to catch up - this way players who are only able to log once or twice a week aren't barred from features because of things they can't control.

However, this would only be the case if a # of quests are required (ex: Do 7 quests to unlock tier 1), but Finn has mentioned specific quests so this next suggestion fits better:

2. Another solution is to prioritize quests. So if you don't start playing until, say, day 28, you can do all 3 required quests that day to access the features, but you have to wait until the next day to be given a normal (radial) quest. This keeps users from being barred from features but also helps put worth into logging daily for radials."



This suggestion has 416 supports and 30 NO supports.



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Edited on 23/07/19 @ 19:12:00 by a Moderator

JaxHammer [Retiring] (#103364)

Savage
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Posted on
2018-04-04 21:32:41
Issues vary with event.

The flirt/slap mechanic in february causes enmity as it actively pits users against each other for currency, which isn't smart. Obviously people wanna slap for currency, but people ALSO want the shops open and it was just a dumb decision to put all the stuff people wanted in the flirt shop. Staff shouldn't be making mechanics that pit users against each other for vital event currency, ESPECIALLY in really important events like february. The slap shop opened quickly, but nothing in it is really worthwhile except the lion scrotes.

People have been begging them to chance that mechanic since 2017, probably earlier. And staff has not listened. It took the combined effort of about 500+ users, in the end, for them to lower the flirt counter because for the millionth time, it was too high. There were similar concerns last event.

Set unlock dates are the way to go. I have yet to see any detractors produce a strong argument against it.



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Dez (#66551)

Confused
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Posted on
2018-04-04 23:07:37
I actually like the idea of having quests be the unlocking mechanism! It seems like a great way to keep people involved.

Also, keeping the additions requiring activity to unlock is sensible, but with the shops on a timed release.



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Heda Vampiric (#56702)

Prophet
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Posted on
2018-04-04 23:39:59

To note, on the quests, and Argryo touched on this, but if the quests are required to access the shop when it unlocks, people should be able to do more than one a day if they are behind.

1. So if a user is on every day, and do their daily quest without missing one, they only get one a day (because they are not behind), but if someone didn't start playing until say, day 6, they could do up to 6 quests that day to catch up - this way players who are only able to log once or twice a week aren't barred from features because of things they can't control.

However, this would only be the case if a # of quests are required (ex: Do 7 quests to unlock tier 1), but Finn has mentioned specific quests so this next suggestion fits better:

2. Another solution is to prioritize quests. So if you don't start playing until, say, day 28, you can do all 3 required quests that day to access the features, but you have to wait until the next day to be given a normal (radial) quest. This keeps users from being barred from features but also helps put worth into logging daily for radials.




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Moonie (#138561)

Sweetheart
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Posted on
2018-04-04 23:51:01
@Heda That is an amazing suggestion! Perhaps daily loggers could get extra perks for completing daily quests consecutively as well? Like the rollover where doing it for so many days in a row earns you a Lucky Foot, Vulture Egg, or a bit of SB? That way there would be more incentive to complete them each day but it wouldn't be a necessity.



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Agryo [7xRos Ely,
Quit] (#84746)


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Posted on
2018-04-05 06:27:23
That's a great addition, Heda! It'll keep the currency/item advantages of daily loggers [they can access the radial 'extra' quests to gain more currency or items] but still doesn't punish someone for, say, only joining Lioden/returning from hiatus on the 29th [they can still complete the key quests to access the shops/special features].

This would also still permit the devs to have the shop/feature openings relatively spaced out for those doing the quests day by day so they can complete new items/decor with a vague timeline on hand.

Also, I would just like to add this about my 'specific quests to unlock shops/tiers' thing: I think I forgot to specify that, in my mind, they'd be pretty short one-off quests, completed within the day. No long chains and waiting, so that if something like this is eventually implemented late-month new members or peeps on hiatus won't have to jump through hoops, just put in a little bit of effort [Say, should take you roughly one energy bar of Exploring to complete, probably gathering currency all the while] and access that shop! ^^



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JaxHammer [Retiring] (#103364)

Savage
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Posted on
2018-04-05 06:39:32
It's a good idea but I doubt staff will implement it. They aren't exactly known for being generous.



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Bezthiel 🍉 (#81210)

Lone Wanderer
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Posted on
2018-04-05 07:25:53
Not one of the community goals has ever given me a sense of community spirit or achievement. And the competition isn't very friendly. It's nagging reminders to "explore harder!" or constantly asking people who are f'ing tired of losing the May arenas "hey, why didn't you enter this time? we need that tier open!" or spam about "stop slapping, waaaah!" and "you guys need to do the ritual!"

All it does it make the site less fun to visit, not foster any spirit or camaraderie. In many of these events it means I stop communicating with the community entirely because they're being childish. That was a very small minority when I first joined, but as always, when a community gets larger, things change. And when the community was smaller, sure, I believe you that it was fun-happy-times with every event where everyone pulled together to get what they want.

But for the past few years it's been nothing but tedious for me.



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JaxHammer [Retiring] (#103364)

Savage
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Posted on
2018-04-05 07:32:16
Well said, Bez. Events are super fucking tedious and always have been in my case.



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Moonie (#138561)

Sweetheart
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Posted on
2018-04-05 07:41:24
Anybody who said NO actually going to come out with a reason or are they just going to sit in a corner? I mean constructive criticism helps people! If you have a legit reason then state it please because I'm sure we'd all like to know why. Honest.



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Finnegan II (#85926)


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Posted on
2018-04-05 08:25:29
Great idea, Heda! Would you mind if I added it to the main post?



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Miss Hades [Penta
Lilac Ferus] (#101360)

Dreamboat of Ladies
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Posted on
2018-04-05 09:28:13
Definite support here.

Unlock tiers are meant for just that - successfully unlocking or not. If they're just going to be adjusted and yet always unlocked last minute anyway it's worth revisting.

Plus I do believe it's led to the mindset of the world ending if tiers don't get unlocked.

This would definitely solve some community distress, and the issue of things always being adjusted in the middle of events.

I'm all for having set unlock dates at that point. Tired of being docked on community success.

In terms of Heda's suggestion with catching up on quests, I love this! Not everybody rolls daily, and it's definitely a way to level that playing field.



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Moonie (#138561)

Sweetheart
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Posted on
2018-04-05 09:33:28
Did anybody like my add on to that? I feel there should be an added bonus for doing it each day in a row but nothing too big, just like with the rollovers where you get a Vulture Egg or Lucky Foot for doing it for so many days in a row. that way there is a bit of an incentive to do it consequently but no big deal if you don't.



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Finnegan II (#85926)


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Posted on
2018-04-05 09:53:44
I like that as well, Moonie. Something small and event specific, like a lucky foot for April, or even a small amount of currency would be nice. Do you mind if I tack that on as well?



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Moonie (#138561)

Sweetheart
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Posted on
2018-04-05 10:01:41
No of course not go ahead and use it



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YakyuuPiffle (#101248)

Magnificent
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Posted on
2018-04-05 10:25:49
Support both the date based option and eventually the quest based option.

I am really really really tired of all the arguments that each month fill the forum.
Each user play the game in his own way and has a different amount of time he/she can spend here. Each user has different interest in event reward (for example, I don't care about most decors and usually buy just apps) so opinions on how the events should be are different and probably all quite valid.

And read topics in which people argue, with some users with really rude manners pretending to always have reason, just ruin the pleasure of playing. I have to admit that lately I'm almost afraid of reading certain topics.

Date based tiers will stop all the arguments, the "do this, don't do that" topics and the unfair piggybacking in certain events.



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