Posted by Lioden Genetics Guide (revised 5/11/15)

Alma (#7695)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2015-05-08 05:27:22
Lioden's new inheritance model is here, and because it's based on another model I proposed (the one you may have seen and voted on in a News post), I thought I'd create a game guide for it to help explain how it works. This new model focuses on four basic factors inherited from one or both parents:
* Color Group: Black, Red, Cream, or Golden
* Gradient: Countershaded vs Solid color
* Shade/Range: Dark or Light
* Rarity: Common or Special

Unlike actual genetics, the only thing that matters is the visible color of each parent. Pedigree/heritage has no bearing on inheritance, and there are no recessive traits or "carriers": what you see is what you're working with. Here's what's at work in this model:


The first factor is Color Group. In this model, a cub will inherit a Color Group from one of its parents. These are the 4 color groups in this model:

photo BlackCSampSColorChartComplete.jpg

Cream Color Group Chart photo CreamColorChartComplete.jpg

Red Color Chart w/ Fiery photo RedColorChartComplete_2.jpg

Gold Color Chart w/Fulvous photo GoldColorChartComplete_3.jpg

If I cross two parents from the Black Color Group, then ALL offspring will come from the Black Color Group. If I cross a parent from the Black Color Group and the Red Color Group, I could get offspring from either the Black or Red Color Groups. If you're looking to produce offspring of a specific color, it is wise to breed parents from the same Color Group if not the same color; if you're looking for surprises and a wide variety of colors, breed two parents from completely different Color Groups.


The next factor in this model is Countershaded vs. Solid Colors, and a cub's appearance will be inherited just like its Color Group (from one parent only unless they're both the same). A Solid color looks exactly as it sounds: the base color is completely or nearly the same throughout the entire coat. A Countershaded color is a base color that has more than one color in its makeup, and while most colors countershade from a dark topline to a lighter underside, others are lighter at the topline and darker on the underside while the most recent is shaded darker along the midline. Here's some examples of what this looks like:

photo CountershadeExamplesFIXED.jpg

If both parents are Countershaded, then all cubs would be Countershaded; if both parents are Solid, then all cubs would be Solid, and if there is one parent of each type, then both Countershaded and Solid cub colors are possible.

If I cross two Countershaded parents, then ALL offspring will be Countershaded, and two Solid parents beget Solid offspring. If I cross a Countershaded parent and a Solid parent, I could get Countershaded or Solid offspring. If you're looking to produce offspring of a specific color, it is wise to breed parents that match the same Shade as your target color if not the same color; if you're looking for surprises and a wide variety of colors, breed a Countershaded parent and a Solid parent, which will increase your variety DRAMATICALLY.


The third factor in this model is Dark or Light Shade/Range. In this model, all colors within a Color Group are arranged into Dark and Light Shade/Ranges. The shade of the offspring is determined just like the other two factors:

Dark Range Color X Dark Range Color = Dark Range Color
Light Range Color X Light Range Color = Light Range Color
Dark Range Color X Light Range Color = Dark OR Light Range Color


I'll quote the original news post in regards to Rarity: "Rarity however is passed differently, and instead of simply being 50/50 between the mom or dad’s there’s only a 15% chance of a special cub per parent breeding. This means: If two specials breed, there is a 30% chance of a special cub. If one special breeds with a common, there is a 15% chance. If two commons breed, there is 0% chance.

Furthermore, there are a few bases that require at least one parent to have the same base when breeding in order to be passed on. Those are: Celestial, Lilac, Sepia, Pearl, Blush Rose, Inferno and Hallowed. Those bases also have a lower drop rate than regular special bases."

Albinos are somewhat different, as explained in Xy's update, "Albino genetics (are) still a random occurrence, but it has a chance of passing now if one parent is Albino, and that chance is higher if both are Albino."


Sounds simple enough, right? Let's give ourselves a chance to get familiar with this system and put all these factors to work! Here are two example breedings:

Example Breeding Similar photo ExampleBreedingSimilar.jpg

Breeding Example Different photo BreedingExampleDifferent_2.jpg

The second example shows how much variety a mismatched cross can give, so if you're looking for surprises, choosing wildly different parents will certainly give you that. On the other hand, if you're looking to breed a cub the same color as one of its parents, it pays to breed the desired parent to an individual of the same color or something from the same Color Group, Gradient, Shade/Range, AND Rarity.

... and that, fellow Lioden-ners (?!) is how Lioden inheritance works! I hope this guide has helped anyone with questions about the system to find the answers you were looking for, but if not, as I promised when I proposed my very first model 15 months ago, I will happily answer questions and help you find the best breeding to meet your goals here. Good luck and happy cub-making!

For the next "installment" of my game guides, here's a how-to about breeding strategies:

Successful Breeding for Specific Colors




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Edited on 11/05/15 by Alma (#7695)

Red (#56730)

Magnificent
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Posted on
2015-06-24 01:43:29
So, am I correct in thinking that if I breed a Celestial and a Celestial, there is a 30% chance that I will get a celestial based cub?



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-06-24 02:31:54
No. Celestial is one of the "super special" bases, meaning it requires one parent to have the base in order for it to pass on to cubs. For those types of bases, the pass rate is lower than other special bases... but they never told us what the pass rate is.

So, the chance is less than 30%, even with two Celestial parents, but we're not sure exactly what it is. :x



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Red (#56730)

Magnificent
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Posted on
2015-06-24 21:50:49
Well that's just lovely >_> I'm sure a nice expensive GB item will crop up eventually to raise the pass rate.
Thanks for the prompt answer :)



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Edited on 25/06/15 by Red (#56730)

Aly (#7926)

Notable Lion
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Posted on
2015-06-27 20:47:09
I'm still confused about the Silver Grey base...
Is it a "super special" base, special or just common?
So could I bred a Maltese with a Cocoa lion and get a Silver Grey cub, or does one of the parents have to be Silver Grey?



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-06-28 02:08:27
Silver Gray is Black Light Countershaded Common. So, it's common, and is one of the bases available in the Oasis customizer, so it is not one of the "super special" bases (you do not need a Silver Gray parent to breed it).

Breeding Maltese x Cocoa does give you a chance at Silver Gray cubs, yes. A pretty good chance, even; Malt x Cocoa can throw Gray, Silver Gray, Malt and Cocoa cubs. Malt and Cocoa are both special, so they have a lower pass rate than Gray and Silver Gray, so by breeding Malt x Cocoa, you'll get mostly Gray and Silver Gray cubs, with the occasional Malt or Cocoa cub tossed in.



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Edited on 28/06/15 by Msasi (#21461)

Aly (#7926)

Notable Lion
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Posted on
2015-06-28 03:38:04
Alright, thank you ^-^'
For some reason I thought it'd be a special base, but looking at one, I see they're common. Thanks for the clarification!



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Alma (#7695)

King of the Jungle
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Posted on
2015-06-30 10:26:36
Thank you as always, Msasi, for manning this thread: I'm going through some pretty serious issues in my personal life at the time, and I'm only logging in about once a week. Although this is how it will probably be for about the next three months, I should be more frequent around here afterwards...

... and as usual, Msasi is awesome! <3 {:oD <3



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-06-30 10:41:15
*huggaAlma* <3 <3 <3

No worries; I don't mind holding down the fort. c:

(And best wishes for your personal life stuff; I know how that is sometimes!)



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KrisB {Maxximus} (#65218)

Deathlord of the Jungle
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Posted on
2015-07-28 11:45:16
Hi Msasi (and Alma if they've returned)!

Quick Question: Does this thread or the wikispaces guide updated more frequently? Like, which one can I rely on for the most up-to-date information? I saw that the Skyward base was added on that guide so I assume it's the latter, but I thought I'd ask just in case ^_^
The guide I mention is this link: http://lioden.wikispaces.com/Genetics



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-07-28 13:22:49
At the moment, the wiki does tend to be a bit quicker to update, yeah. :) Alma is good about updating this thread generally, but is a but busy with IRL stuff at the moment. So, feel free to use both this thread and the wiki, and you're always welcome to come ask me if you have any questions. :D



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Fieora (#26148)

Phoenix
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Posted on
2015-07-31 05:08:51
So.. if I breed a sepia boy to a fiery will Prune cubs come into the range of possibility or only if I breed Sepia to prune? Little confused about the cross range ^^



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-07-31 05:16:36
Sepia x Fiery can produce the entire range of the Red group,since Sepia is Red Dark Solid Special and Fiery is Red Light Countershaded Special. Prune is Red Dark Countershaded Special, so it definitely comes into play! As long as the traits of the base you're wanting can be created with some combination of the two parents' traits, it can be a possible result from that pairing (aside from the super special bases that require one parent have that base in order for it to pass). So, Prune gets its Dark from Sepia, its Countershaded from Fiery, and gets Red and Special from both. :)

So, Sepia x Fiery can produce: Mahogany, Brown, Sepia (super special, but possible since one parent is Sepia), Brass, Prune, Beige, Fallow, Sunshine, Copper, Deira, Sandy and Fiery. :)



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Fieora (#26148)

Phoenix
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Posted on
2015-07-31 05:30:24
Thank you so much Msasi ^^
Wasn't sure if the fallow/sunshine group would be in play but even so I think it makes it worth making my Sepia boy the next heir over my fiery/prune den =D
Beats golden cubs for sure ^^



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Snowcat13-5x
cimmerian G1 (#52694)

Prince of the Savannah
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Posted on
2015-08-01 00:06:06
So there are a total of only 9 skyward bases released from July event. So far none have produced a skyward. My daughters has been bred twice, and none so far. I wasn't here for the event last year. I wonder since the specials are so much harder to breed now if they released more, or the same as the celestials last year. Seems like not enough were released given the low drop rate. I really want one. LOL



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Msasi (#21461)

True King
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Posted on
2015-08-01 03:03:53
Hm. I don't know if anyone kept a record, but I want to say that the number of Skyward vs number of Celestial girls released was likely fairly close to the same. Once we get one of those girls to pass on the base to a cub, I'm sure we'll see a Skyward king, which will help spread the base, since males can breed a lot more often than the girls can. The pass rate will just help the base stay rarer for longer, which tends to be what players want (at least, when they have the base so they can make a profit selling; not so much buyers who are wanting the base like we all are now, ahaha).



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