-LOCKED - A Statement About Moderating
Posted on 2019-02-21 12:54:31
Hi all, Abbey here on behalf of the admin and moderating teams.

We'd like to announce right now that in the coming weeks we are planning on removing moderator badges across the entire site. We are not demoting moderators or getting rid of any systems, we are just removing the badge from visible areas next to player names. We hope that this will make the game a better place to be for both players and moderators, and hope that moderators and players can have a less tense relationship with one another.

Addressing Moderating Concerns


We would like to take this opportunity to address some concerns that players have raised with regards to the moderating system.

The anonymity of moderators within the modbox has now been in effect for over a year and over this time we have seen that this system has worked very well from behind the scenes. However, we do acknowledge that there has been some scepticism from various members over how this system actually works.

So for the sake of transparency and clarification, we'd like to give some insight to our moderating practices and how the system works for moderators and admins versus members.

Firstly, a PSA:
Moderators and admins are two very different roles on the site.

Admins are the group of staff who handle the game's functionality and features. They each have different roles, but they talk with each other on a daily basis about various things regarding running the game. Admins decide when rules should change, when changes to the game should be made, they are responsible for the coding and artwork coordination, and general behind-the-scenes stuff. The community admins work daily with the moderators whereas the non-community admins do not.

Moderators are volunteer members of the team who help us handle rule-breaking members. They are sometimes asked for input on various changes to how we moderate, rule changes, but ultimately have no control over the main parts of the game. They do not have the ability to change event bars, or add items to shops, or anything like that. Moderators are purely for moderating the forums, chat and players as a whole. They enforce the rules, and have no ability to edit the game in any way.

Anonymous Moderators
On the front-end of the modbox, we changed it so that members could no longer see specifically which moderator was handling their ticket.

This change was made primarily to cease some of the targeting that staff were seeing from members after having a decision made on their ticket that the member disagreed with. Additionally, if a moderator took some time to respond, they would sometimes start receiving PMs.

A lesser-known reason for why we changed the modbox to only show "Moderating Team" is because we felt as though it was dishonest of us to claim that one single person handled a ticket. This sometimes turned into a moderator being disliked because they were viewed as being the sole person who made a decision that someone didn't like, when in fact that decision likely had the input and support of multiple moderators and an admin.

Additionally, ANY response from a specific admin came with the support and input of every single member on the admin team, regardless of who actually claimed and handled that ticket.

Why do tickets take so long sometimes?
Firstly, the vast majority of tickets have at least a second opinion from another moderator or an admin. Moderators do not moderate and make decisions alone as a rule. Those that take longer to resolve often have the input of a large portion of the moderating team and sometimes multiple admins. This takes time for everyone to have a discussion, give their input, and ultimately come to a decision on what to do.

Just like players, moderators act under a specific ruleset, they are under constant supervision of admins and other moderators. Moderators have never banned a user for no reason - we always act on information or reports. If we believe we have made a mistake in our decisions, we will try to correct it and inform the player involved.

Why did X get punished, but Y didn't? Why did Z get banned for doing nothing?
Because we don't discuss player punishments publicly, the only time any information about reprimands comes out is from the player themselves. Sometimes a player disagrees with a decision we have made and will tell friends that they got a raw deal.

This is fine, we appreciate that everyone takes away a different account of what happened, but please be aware that there is always more to the story.

Additionally, if one player was punished for something but another player wasn't - we ask you to please trust that we handle all reports of rule-breaking behaviour fairly according to our terms of service and code of conduct. It is possible that they have received punishment, perhaps not the same as you because there were a different set of circumstances surrounding the event, or for a variety of other reasons.

If you witness a user breaking the rules, then we strongly advise you to report that behaviour to us. We rely very heavily on reports of rule-breaking behaviour - we encourage members to report anonymously when they come across this on the site.

Why don't you discuss player punishments publicly?
Logs of player punishments actually fall under "personal data" as of the GDPR of May 2018 so we legally cannot disclose any information about player punishment with other members.

We have always had this rule in place, however, so that is not the full reason. We dislike bringing up player punishments due to the subjectivity of what has happened to cause the punishment. Moderators have to rule on varying degrees of the same rule.

For instance, what exactly constitutes scamming? How can we tell this was a definite scam? Where do we draw the line on what is a scam and what is just a promise transaction that never went through due to various reasons? What effect does this scam have on the victims, and the economy as a whole?

Additionally, we prioritise the maintenance of a user's privacy - nobody should be privy to what happens as the result of a ticket other than the moderating team and that user.

We heard you don't use off-site evidence but there have been some times you have used it?
We don't use off-site evidence as a general rule because it is very easy to fake screenshots, or impersonate someone when we don't have the back-end information that Lioden provides to us. If there is concrete evidence that this person has definitely done something offsite (e.g. is selling Lioden items/lions for real money) and we can verify it on Lioden then we will happily take off-site evidence into account.

Moderating - moving forward
We want to continue being a great team who works together to moderate Lioden. We hope that removing the moderator paws from moderators will allow them to play the game normally, as a real member. They have been forced into the spotlight since day one and we'd like to offer them the opportunity to sit back and enjoy the game as a member once more.

However, this doesn't mean there are no longer mods. We will be ensuring that we keep a team fully stocked and raring to go so that any reports and tickets created by members are handled promptly and fairly.

We would respectfully ask that you don't message formerly listed mods about whether they are still a moderator or not as we believe they are entitled to their privacy with this change.

If you encounter an unfair ruling or something that isn't handled how you think it should be, we still encourage you to report your ticket to the support email (support@lioden.com) or Abbey (#1).

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If you have any transparency questions, or questions about how we moderate and why we make some decisions, please ask and we will try to answer in admin responses over the following few days. Please keep in mind we will not answer questions about specific cases.



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Aslan (#128364)

Incredible
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:24:37



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AimPyre | G2
Jellyfish Preon (#98461)


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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:25:16



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⚡Patchidk (#161180)


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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:26:43
I think this is a good idea to be honest. Good job guys.



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Rhaast ✿ Ice G1
11BO (#40493)

Total Chad
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:27:14
This is going to be funny



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Edited on 21/02/19 @ 13:34:21 by Rhaast ✿ [Interstellar] (#40493)

🪐TelekineticIssue (#164449)

Bone Collector
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:27:28
This move seems like an excellent step in making sure Lioden keeps running smoothly. I may be a new player still, and I’ve only interacted with mods once, but I was very pleased with how the situation was handled. I appreciate the transparency on this; I don’t doubt that it was a well-thought out decision for the better!

A general statement out to the admins and moderators: thank you all for the spectacular work you all do for Lioden and its players. You’re doing an incredible job!



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Miss Hades [7.2k Ice
Primal] (#100240)

Cursed
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:27:34
In any successful site with any casual and healthy moderation, I have always seen staff interacting with players on a player level, unless otherwise needed. Your user base cannot learn to respect their staff members if their staff members are taking multiple measures to hide.

While I hope it helps, it's hard to be excited about these changes when staff hiding from problems is the driving issue at play.

I completely understand not discussing punishment, that's totally fair and something you can find anywhere.

But staying anon? How am I supposed to trust a group of 'leaders' who are hiding?

Hmm.

Tension occurs when trust is not mutual on both sides. And sure. Players are at fault for that too. But you can't build relationships behind a wall.


Admin Response:
Admins can see which moderators are handling which tickets, and if you ever have a problem with the way your ticket was handled, or how you feel you were treated by a moderator, you can contact the support email or Abbey (#1) directly on Lioden.

Moderators will still be actively moderating the site, as before. Nothing changes from that respect.

We hope moderators will be treated the same way you would treat any other player.


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AimPyre | G2
Jellyfish Preon (#98461)


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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:29:56
I agree with Miss Hades completely.



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🐝 Ginger_Bee 🐝 (#167127)

Angelic
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:29:57
This feels very shady and fishy...
Wonder why they're suddenly hiding...?


Admin Response:
I hope you understand the reasons why we are making this change, as outlined in the news post! :)


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Roxanne (#121082)


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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:30:46
Does this mean I have to remove the mod stamps from my den page?
I've already seen one moderator remove theirs from my page ^^


Admin Response:
You're free to leave the ones you currently have up.


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till (#146959)

Punk
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:31:53
I do appreciate this recent post- it was rather informative and nicely worded as well as written! Most of the choices were smart and will, hopefully, end up assisting the community and the staff to come to a mutual ground. Or, at the very least- let the Mods be treated like normal people in chat with no-one acting stiff around them, or directly towards them.

Though about the choice of directly removing the mod paws is a double-edged sword. Yes; it will decrease the amount of harassment aimed towards an individual- (which frankly no-one deserves ^^) and hopefully lessen stress and pressure that rested amongst the Mods shoulders. But it doesn't help with the goal of transparency- nor does it assist with the topic of praise or criticism. The kind of criticism that helps one improve as a person, but also doesn't harmfully target them. Us members will no longer be able to hold them accountable for how they act- be it good or bad. Therefore; chances are the mods won't get constructive criticism or gentle nudges in the right direct towards being a better person and staff member to such a large site overall. How this choice in moderating will be taken will depend on what edge of the sword is sharper I guess-

Though I hope it ends up fine <3


Edit;
Fair point- I will take error there in the fact that we can't really state much on how badly the Mods get harassed, due to us not being able to see half of it- so I probably shouldn't have spoken on that ^^


Admin Response:
Members will still be able to report any negative interactions with moderators, at which point we will hold them directly accountable.

We don't think being harassed is worth the occasional constructive criticism, when we can filter that for them and they can just have fun playing Lioden again.


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Edited on 21/02/19 @ 13:37:20 by 🌺Commie (#146959)

{🌌} Elementalist
{🌌} (#56591)

Heavenly
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:33:53
Love the new post!



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Pihka (#127136)

Remarkable
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:35:58
Thank you for letting us know



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꧁Qunx꧂maofelis
korat (#134478)

Pervert
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:37:46
thank you lioden staff! it's always appreciated when you make a post regarding safety and other things!



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Edited on 21/02/19 @ 13:39:07 by ꧁★❣Quinxels❣★꧂ (#134478)

🐯Golden
Tigress🐯 (#100594)

Deathlord of the Jungle
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:38:32
First of all, good afternoon to all.

Look I am TOTALLY against such an update, first of all, for you to give such power to the moderators. Some of them, they already feel that they have the confidence of you.
Now, that they will be able to ban anyone they want, you will see what hell is. Simp'limente, because some people do not have the ability to share the professionals' personal things.

That, at least in MY point of view, is laziness. I know they're busy, but who wants to cheat? They settled down. Achyam that for the simple fact of "taking" this "weight" of the back will improve, but it will not.
I do not want to generate friction, but, uh ... this is going to be a big, big shit.

I just hope that they know that they have just given rise to a world war.


Admin Response:
Admins can see which moderators are handling which tickets, and if you ever have a problem with the way your ticket was handled, or how you feel you were treated by a moderator, you can contact the support email or Abbey (#1) directly on Lioden.

Moderators will still be actively moderating the site, as before. Nothing changes from that respect.

We hope moderators will be treated the same way you would treat any other player.


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Fading Angel (G2 2k)
[Frozen] (#81854)

Holy
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Posted on
2019-02-21 13:40:54
How will they ban whoever?
They still have to discuss issues with each other and admin(s)?
So if someone gets banned, its because a group choose it to be best



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