My question is, if Azazel the Goat exists on Lioden, which is a more controversial icon (or I assume it would or should be since it's a direct representation of an Abrahamic figure), why would including a dreidal, menorah, or latke encounter or decor be something that needs to be excluded?

If you are unfamiliar with Azazel, it's Leviticus chapter 16, a reference to both Judaism and Christianity.
Oya even says during the July event, "Welcome brave lion! With the smoke of this incense, we should be able to communicate. I am Sangoma Oya and this is my goat, Azazel. He used to be a scapegoat for the floods, but he became my pet. Do not eat, no. Bad lion!"
"Scapegoat" is a direct reference to the chapter in Leviticus, btw.

Religion has already been introduced onto Lioden.
So to say "religious symbology should not be on Lioden" isn't a good argument to prevent more decor from being added, because religious decor is already here.

For the sake of this topic in particular: knowing that religious symbolism has already been introduced on site, knowing that the acknowledgement of both traditional African religions (references to shamanism in November) and Abrahamic religions (religious figures in both Judaism and Christianity at least, and Christmas), why is the answer exclusion only when it comes to holiday celebrations?

I'm more inclined to agree with mythhletoe, in that the winter event would have to be redone and all religious acknowledgement removed on site if the reason people don't want diverse holiday traditions to be added is that religious references are inherently offensive.

I guess my question can be even more specific: why would mentioning Hannukah in either an encounter or decor be more offensive than making an Abrahamic character a funny goat during an event heavily revolving around "rituals?"

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Sorry, I know that last point got a little wordy, but I'm having trouble understanding the perspective and I'm trying to get a better understanding.

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I worded it wrong, yes Hanukkah is a religious holiday but it's more than that, how many of you know the story behind Hanukkah? the context of the meaning? what does it mean for Jewish people? in short answer it means hope.

It's the outside world (in this case greeks) coming to destroy, strip and convert the Jewish people to the Greek culture and beliefs.
They destroyed everything that symbolizes Jewdisem in the temple, except for one small holy olive pot which was discovered and by miracle lasted 8 days.
It symbolizes that no matter how much outside forces try to break, destroy and wipe out the Jewish culture and beliefs, we will always raise up from the ashes no matter what is thrown at us.
This is why in WWII, or ANY other genocides/oppressions against the Jews (there are plenty google it), Jewish people risked their lives to celebrating Hanukkah because it symbolized hope, the will to fight against the oppression, that no matter what we will survive. In the Jewish culture, you are born a Jew and you die a Jew no matter if you convert to any other religion.

This is why, while I understand wanting to be inclusive, at the same time Hanukkah is much more than an encounter or a decor for some.

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I appreciate your perspective Red.

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By all means, you can add a decor or an encounter, I'll just find it distasteful that's all.

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Red~

I actually had do to research about what hanukkah is and why it was celebrated because I rarely see it in any form of media. I am on bored with bringing in decor because it could provide a very short explanation about it's importance.

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I really hope that the admins will look into adding something to recognize other December holidays like they recognize Christmas <3 It would be really great to see a couple decorations other than what I see everywhere irl around this time of year

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Hey Red,
I don't see why your argument here is toward not supporting the inclusivity of Hanukkah because it's, to some, much more than just a holiday. That's true, but it's also true of all other religions, and tbh I don't really see why we couldn't have some Hanukkah themed decor if we already have Christmas themed decor, too. I feel like it's a great chance to be inclusive, and not as far as a reach for Lioden staff to add since we already have things like pride flags in the form of feathers, which is official Lioden decor. It's obviously important to be respectful, which i think is your point, but I don't think that Lioden staff would handle the matter in such a way that it would be disrespectful to those who celebrate Hanukkah if they've already handled Christmas respectfully and in a fun, lighthearted way.

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Red's concerns are understandable and respectful, and I don't see why anyone should feel the need to devalue or... for lack of a better word, 'defeat' them. People have legitimate reasons to not support this idea, and even if others disagree with those reasons, they are just as important to bare in mind.

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If LD incorporates a Jewish holiday representation, i think it would be unfair not to incorporate a holiday from the second largest religion on earth which is Islam.
I would personally like to hear the opinions from fellow Muslim members.

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What is the issue with that, though? I mean, there's no Islamic imagery or references in Lioden right now, just like there's no Hanukkah imagery or reference in Lioden, which is the whole point of this thread. In fact, OP would probably want this, too - which is why the thread is called "Other holidays" and not just Hanukkah. I'm confused, is that supposed to be like a counterargument or? Because if it is, the simple solution is just to also...add other religions...like, you realize that, right?

Also no point in arguing against adding other religions when you're an athiest. Kinda makes you look more like you don't want anything other than Christianity Christmas, which I know isn't what you want, but gotta be careful with that. :/

Also not trying to "defeat" any of Red's arguments, just trying to civilly talk out a solution to them. Nothing wrong with pointing out "Hey, I think what you said is valid, but here's a good way to consider what you said and arrive at a satisfying conclusion." Which. is what everyone's trying to do on this thread!^^

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I would personally like to hear the opinions from fellow Muslim members.

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Yuriko makes a great point and you didn’t answer any of their questions...

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I am not interested in debating my point of view, im intrested only in the opinion of fellow Muslims members regarding adding other holidays from different religions which is the title of the thread.

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It’s still kinda rude not to answer someone when they ask you a question.

Also, you say “fellow Muslim members,” but stated a couple pages back that you’re an atheist?

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